For your pleasure, and the right to applaud(Yeah)

I give you the latest circus to appear in Public.

They are the (ha ha Ruling body of the peasants)

Their ideas are bigger than their heads; and that’s saying something.

Report abuse

Clearly, that would be ludicrous. My amendment proposed no such thing.

What it did propose was that a departmental political board should continue to assume responsibility for making policy in areas that fall within its mandate. Further, in line with our system of government, it proposed that the Policy Council’s role should be one of co-ordinating policies rather than the power to develop policy being sucked up to the centre.

It’s important to note that although the States retains ultimate political authority, and while in any parliamentary democracy parliament is capable of amending or defeating proposals put before it, a great deal of political influence rests in the hands of those who develop and shape policy in the first place.

However, we debated the issue at some length. And Dave is correct in saying that the majority of States members disagreed with my view about how the FSR should proceed. As with all policy decisions, those of who were in the minority on this occasion will just have to respect the outcome, get on with the task in hand and make things work to the best of our ability.

Report abuse

I must be missing something here – the democratically-elected House voted democratically to give the group the extra power. The group did NOT give themselves the extra power !

Report abuse

Janet
There has been no overspends since the Policy Council was formed although I haven’t seen the details on the new clinical block.
TL

“I am not questioning the integrity of the members involved but, as a matter of principle, this has turned Guernsey into a state governed by people with no mandate to govern.”

The mandate is in the hands of the States of deliberation they are the people who voted this through and therefore gave the FSR team the go ahead to take the necessary measures to reduce waste and government spending overall.

Jonny

A group of elected officials have NOT given themselves more power the States of Guernsey have given the PC through the FSR team the authority to press ahead with FSR.

Report abuse

Report abuse

Speaking for myself, it’s because I don’t really know what to say. I know that it’s already a done deal, my opinions don’t count, and that they are simply going to do what they like, as always.

Just looking at the lineup in the photo with all those cat that got the cream, smug faces of those who have placed themselves in (almost) absolute power makes my blood boil yet run cold at the same time, especially when I consider the actions and opinions of several of them during their time in office.

Lower pensions, threatening behaviour, racial jokes, the death of the parish primary schools, a blatant unwillingness to implement the much needed changes highlighted in the WAO report – yet suddenly this eagerness to implement change (cunningly accompanied by a huge increase in their power) – and that’s just the good bits.

This totally undemocratic process is wrong in the extreme, but bearing in mind the above, it’s hardly surprising that some don’t ‘feel the ‘need’ to, and with all this talk of becoming independent of the UK, I wouldn’t be at all surprised if we next see LT declaring himself the king and reinstating public floggings for any dissenters.

Report abuse

You need to lead the way on this. This has to be one of the most important issues that have developed in Guernsey politics for many many years.

It is an absolute disgrace a group of elected officials can decide to suddenly implement more power to themselves. If roles change, the people in these roles have to HAVE TO be democratically elected, whether it be the states members or the public.

Report abuse

What mandate did they have ?

In whose intrests will they use that authority ?

To who they will be accountable to ?

How can they be democratically removed from this cabinet they have formed ?

Where is the Shadow Cabinet who will oppose them ?

If they are truly democratic they should feel uncomfortable to the position they have appointed themselves to and seek an manadate to all this by the means of an election.

Report abuse

I fully agree. This is an insult to democracy. The Policy Council has absolutely NO mandate for their new role.

There should be an election with island – wide voting as soon as is practibably possible and in the mean time all Policy Council members should place themselves up for re-election for their place on it.

Report abuse

Report abuse

Putting that aside for a moment, I strongly believe that if we are to have executive government, it is vital that island wide voting is implemented as soon as possible. I cannot see how Deputies who only required just over 1,000 votes to secure election have been given the mandate to wield that level of power.

Report abuse

At a stroke, the States has become undemocratic.

The public have had no opportunity to elect these members to the Council or to even to elect them to the States at a time when it was contemplated that they could be granted these powers.

I am not questioning the integrity of the members involved but, as a matter of principle, this has turned Guernsey into a state governed by people with no mandate to govern.

I appreciate that the executive powers have parameters, but none of us cast our votes with this system in mind.

The States should be ashamed of themselves.

Report abuse

Report abuse

So where do we go from here?, if the power for change lies with the Policy Council, who have proven that they will not change except to enhance their own position, Guernsey is left to continue this downward spiral. Are there mechanisms to have a half time team talk, make substitutions and a tactical change so all the team is refreshed and motivated so we, Guernsey United, go on to win the game.

Report abuse

You have raised a very good point. In the interests of democracy there must be a strong case for members of the Policy Council submitting themselves for re-election.

The role and expectations of the Policy Council have now changed quite significantly. When I voted in the ministerial elections immediately after the general election of 2008, I voted on the basis of the Policy Council’s function as it was then, which was largely one of policy co-ordination, whereas they have now been handed very wide-ranging executive powers to develop policy in several areas that were previously the responsibility of departmental political boards.

We now have an unfortunate and peculiar situation where the mandates of Policy Council and States departments do not adequately reflect what is expected of them in respect of the efficiency opportunities identified in the Fundamental Spending Review. For example, in 2008 the States elected five members of the Health & Social Services Department to develop health and social services policies, whereas in respect of the HSSD-related items in the spending review policy changes will be developed and sponsored not by that department’s political board but by the political members of the Policy Council, who were never elected for that purpose.

It is a question of securing a democratic mandate to develop policy and being accountable on that basis. Without that, there exists a democratic deficit.

TL,

I agree that cabinet-style government without political parties is fundamentally undemocratic.

I also agree that party politics is neither necessary nor particularly healthy in small communities like ours, so long as we do not adopt a cabinet-style system. However, as the example of Jersey demonstrates, executive government is much more likely to provoke the establishment of party politics; indeed, arguably it makes them essential.

On your final point, the States of Deliberation is the ultimate political authority in the island. It can establish whatever form of government it considers appropriate at any time. So, yes – the States could amend the powers vested in the Policy Council. But don’t expect a reduction in those powers any time soon – it seems far more likely that the centralisation of powers will be accelerated under this States.

Arnald,

I don’t really wish to become involved in the personality issues here, but for the record I think you will find that Deputy Flouquet, despite his seat on Policy Council, remains one of the most committed supporters of consensus government [and opponents of cabinet government] in the States. That has always been his position, as I understand it.

Report abuse