GUERNSEY police moved to reassure islanders after armed officers were spotted near the Vale Church and in the Fauxquets Valley yesterday.
Firearms officers have been taking part in training exercises and more will be carried out until Thursday and from Monday until Thursday next week. The exercises will be conducted all over the island but none of the guns are loaded.
Inspector JP Le Breton (pictured) said that officers did put up signs and spoke to neighbours to warn them about exercises and those conducting the training also wear ‘instructor’ jackets.
However one islander who saw armed police in Fauxquets Valley yesterday said they should do more to warn the public. Debbie Troth was driving in the valley yesterday when she was overtaken by three police cars and saw officers with guns.
She was told afterwards it was a training exercise but said the experience had left her shaking like a leaf.
- Read the full story in the Guernsey Press. See below for subscription details.
Article posted on 13th July, 2010 - 1.00pm
53 Article Comments
I read the main article in the GP today. This woman makes me laugh, she is in the paper near on every week complaining about the Police. Get a hobbie!
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shacking like a leaf? I could understand if someone kicked down her door and pointed a gun at her! However just driving past and seeing something and shacking like a leaf, hmmm.
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It is still good to know that the general public has a healthy respect for the Police Force (with or without firearms). I am sure that this lady would be the first to complain if untrained officers were to respond inadequately or not to a standard expected if there was a genuine firearms incident.
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Good call AiG – I’ll sleep better tonight knowing that, if a serious incident occurred, we have officers who (at least in theory) know how to respond if the gun cabinet needs unlocking.
As a visitor to a number of nations around the globe I would also suggest that with such a nervous disposition this lady doesn’t travel abroad too often. Police with guns are a regular site not only abroad, but also in British airports where they are armed with submachine guns.
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In the real world the Police would not have the luxury of knowing when something of this nature is going to happen so it is only right the scenario is kept as close to reality as possible.
Quit your whinging woman. It is getting boring now. None of the weapons were loaded. Where is the threat?
She should count herself lucky she lives in such a peaceful Island with well equipped services on hand so any real threat is dealt with quickly & efficiently. Maybe a few weeks in Afghanistan or Iraq would make her think long & hard about how fortunate she & her offspring truly are.
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surely she’s clever enough to know that the police force in guernsey don’t go round pointing guns at people for no reason.
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why cant they go and play there games at fort le marchant put the red flags up and public are out the way
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Doesn’t she understand the real need for our Police force to be fully trained in such situations, a gunman on the rampage is a more common occurrence than you might think in Guernsey.
Personally I’m looking forward to when they blow up a planne at the airport so that the firemen and staff up there can train properly for a terrorist attack, or maybe set a fuel tanker on fire down at St Sampson’s to allow firemen to train for that situation as well.
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Maybe you should put yourself in this woman’s shoes just for 1 minute!
She had not seen ANY signs and wasn’t the only person to be terrified by the experience, another driver behind her reversed at high speed to turn around and get out of there, I wonder if they did not see any signs too? Or are they both blind? It would be interesting to see what they had to say I hope they come forward and say how it made them feel.
If that had been my pop, in his 80’s, he would have had a heart attack, then this would be a totally different story and have totally different reactions and comments for the Police Department.
Have you ever had a gun pointed in your direction? Not knowing if its loaded or not? Not knowing but pressuming that they were searching for someone armed and dangerous?
Then not even an apology and to see officers sniggering at you!
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Yes they have to train and we all support that BUT more could have been done to secure the safety and wellbeing of the general public.
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SJ are you the lady in question … Debbie Troth?
Even if there weren’t sign (which there were) why would you think of all things when you see a policeman with a gun that they were coming to chase you down and shoot you!?
has this lady never seen a policeman with a gun??
As Paul Le Page says go anywhere in the world and police will be carrying guns!
Plus sorry SJ but if your pop is likely to have a heart attack at the sight of a policeman with a gun maybe he shouldn’t be driving.
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Does the serial moaner of Guernsey never give up? I guess as she has not been in the media moaning about nothing for a week or two that she felt this was a good chance!!
Well done to our boys in blue for the very hard job you have on this Island. They need to practise somewhere and no doubt you found out where and were following them!!!
Get a life and stop moaning it is boring now!
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@SJ “Yes they have to train and we all support that BUT more could have been done to secure the safety and wellbeing of the general public.”
Correct me if I’m wrong but wasn’t that exactly what they were doing?
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MISSY no I am not the woman in question thankfully.
My pop is still healthy enough to drive and has to pass a medical to receive his licence.
Maybe I should have said that if that had been my pop, the shock of seeing a weapon pointed at him, after the years he spent in the war, it could have given him a heart attack. A fair point in my opinion, sorry if you disagree.
I completely support the fact that our officers need to do this training to look after all of us in the right way, my point is we should be notified in the correct ways when this is to happen.
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I for one am happy that the Police are doing training, whether it be firearms, bombs, dogs or driver training. Training should ensure a safer, quicker, more practical response to potentially difficult and possibly life threatening situation that thankfully normal everyday people like I and your other readers do not have to face.
The recent scenarios in both Cumbria and Northumbria show that nowhere is safe from maniac’s with guns who decide, for whatever reason, that the general public are ‘fair game’ and are to be treated like targets at a fairground.
Living in London I see Police Officers with guns patrolling the streets and do not envy them going into potential life threatening situations, running towards the scene of a shooting whilst everyone else is running away from it. Just the other day on my normal route to work along Hendon way a man was shot several times whilst sat in traffic – yes, he was killed.
Whilst I’m not saying that this is likely to happen in Guernsey is it not a common sense approach that the Police should be trained and ready for it if the worst happens and it does take place?
As for being told in advance of the training as to where and when it takes place, I understand signs were put up and those in the immediate surrounding areas were notified. Is the reader suggesting that a public announcement is made on the Radio/TV/Paper or postal details put through everyones door just in case they dont hear the other options? Are they to provide a route detail of where they are going and what time they will be there? If that were the case I would envisage a row of deck chairs and picnic hampers out for people to watch at each location what goes on. We see this at the scene of an accident everybody stopping to ‘have a look’.
Whilst I accept your reader may have been to use her words ’shaking like a leaf’ – I get the impression that this is more of a case of a chance to ‘have a go’ at the Police as she seems to have had a lot of negative dealing with them in the past from reading your papers Court reports. I’m sorry but I can’t take her complaint seriously and as for the Press deaming it a fit and proper news worthy item! well I can only say that nothing must be going on and news must be slow at the moment.
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@London Donkey. Well put and carrying on from that…
@ The Guernsey Press, do you really think this is worthy news? The Police of Guernsey and Police in general have a hard time gaining the respect of SOME members of the public. A story like this fuels hatred amongst some and obviously shows little reflection of public opinion.
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SJ – “Maybe I should have said that if that had been my pop, the shock of seeing a weapon pointed at him, after the years he spent in the war, it could have given him a heart attack. A fair point in my opinion, sorry if you disagree.”
I don’t disagree with that, i defy to you find someone who wouldn’t be distressed having had a weapon pointed at them. But I (unless I missed something) didn’t read anywhere in the article that any guns were pointed at Ms Troth, so I’m not sure of the relevance of your point?….
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I think she needs to grow a pair and get on with her life, which, as it seems must be well boring to complain so much.
The Police gave as much warning as the should have, its not like if someone was going to rob a bank in town with a gun the police would stop half way there and say ‘ oh wait, we need to inform everyone so lets wait for the radio and the postmen to deliver letters and news of it first…. and Then we can go and sort out the problem, we wouldnt want anyone to be suprised now would we’. Its reality so get over it.
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Kev Chandler:
Hmmm. Playing games? Are you really so childish and small minded as to consider this training a ‘game’?
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Nice to check in on the site! Please don’t stop prinitng this stuff it provides us ex Guerns with an endless source of amusement!
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There will always be one person who doesn’t get the message no matter what they do.
Hardly news worthy. Another bashing for the police. It’s like a circuit. Police, UK developers, States….Police, UK developers, lost dog, States…hedge measurements…
You do have to laugh though, it’s the only way to cope.
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Totally agree with London Donkey. Whilst I have no particular comment to make on the issue of Ms Troth’s experience I would assume that the Gsy Police probably didn’t widely advertise their training for exactly the reason that there would be people popping along to the area just to ‘have a nose’ (a common trait amongst some) which may very well have impeded the whole exercise. I am getting pretty fed up at the Guernsey Press’s continuing ‘tabloid’ style journalism with headlines that make something out of nothing.
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I have just had a look at the other “Have Your Shout” topics, most of which look to me to be more worthy of comment. This lady has surely had more than her 15 minutes of fame, one GEP interview, one headliner in previous news items, one radio spot, several posts on this topic, previous grievances – etc,etc.
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For goodness sake…I think all have said enough. The police need to train and the only reason to be worried about seeing a policeman/woman with a gun is if you’re up to no good.
If the poor lady had seen someone OTHER than a policeman with a gun then I’m sure she’d have reason to be worried.
Of course on the other hand if the police had closed the whole area there would an outcry because Mrs Bloggs couldn’t go to her favourite hedge veg stall or whatever.
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she’s a bit like Jordan is our ‘Ms’ Troth, she loves her 15mins of fame.
Give it a rest love. The police have a job to do and they need training sessions. The people living in the area knew it was happening. Why should they close a road, if it was real then its exactly what would have happened. The police work very hard. How about congratulating them on the recent excellent work they did catching jewel thiefs etc…
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I saw some gun wielding paint ballers dome Petit Bot valley last week – a veritable army of potential terrorists- scared the life out of me – something should be done – it was a nightmare – they could have had someone’s eye out – I was scared for my life – the States need to do something – I think some were Latvian – think of the children – are they allowed to do that on a Sunday? – will you sign my petition?
To whom do I write a strongly worded letter? :)
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To both Valandra and Neil – Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha :-)
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Jimmy
“The police need to train and the only reason to be worried about seeing a policeman/woman with a gun is if you’re up to no good”
I’m sure the family of Charles de Menezes (and several others) might disagree with you on that one
Read more: http://www.thisisguernsey.com/2010/07/13/woman-shaking-like-a-leaf-after-police-gun-exercise/#ixzz0tsQRYA74
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I saw this incident and was quite possibly behind Mrs Troth’s car.
I drove into the valley to find a car stopped in the road. Maybe 40 metres or so further up the road several cars (including Police cars) were blocking the way, surrounded by armed Police. It looked as though the officers were moving into the fields at the side of the road.
My first thought was that they’d been called out to apprehend some nutjob with a shotgun. A bit imaginative perhaps, but what kind of incidents usually require an armed response?
The road being blocked, and thinking it was a real incident which would probably last for a while, I simply backed up and took a diversion (kind of wondering if the nutjob with his shotgun would jump out of a hedge!)
There were no signs or anything saying that this was a training exercise (that I saw) and the Officers were too far up the road to read the backs of their bullet jackets.
I can’t comment on Mrs Troth’s reaction but I assumed it was a real event until the Press article and curious lack of ‘armed manhunt’ headlines in the news.
It seemed remarkable to me that there was no ‘Police Training’ sign, or a marshall in the road to inform people they were driving into an ‘exercise’.
Of course, the Police have to train, but when they’re doing it, with guns, in public – it seems common sense to have some kind of warning for passersby.
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Eth, let’s be reasonable. Read the article, a lot was done to warn passersby.
I remember a while back coming down to the Imperial and seeing a sign saying “police Training exercise”, and another one at that woodwork place further along the coast towards L’Eree.
I was driving between the 2 signs when the cars shot past me.
Now, I knew it was going on as I saw a sign. But if I just came out of a lane, or someone’s driveway I wouldn’t have seen a sign. What do you want them to do?! Post signs/put up banners/perhaps a helicopoter with a big banner dangling down from it?
Let’s not all be so easily shocked!!
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Eth – I personally don’t remember seeing any others but the issue with many here seems to be that Ms Troth has gained a reputation locally as “the lady that cried wolf” by her constant public complaints about the police. Any complaints she therefore makes, even when they have some legitimacy, are immediately dismissed.
Personally I agree with Billythefish – the police took reasonable measures and unless they personally contact everyone there will always be some people who don’t get the message. Perhaps we got rid of the sirens too quick eh?
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Well, whether Mrs Troth’s reaction was proportionate is not something I have an opinion on. I just wanted to add my honest reaction to driving into the exercise;
I wasn’t “shocked”, but I did think it was a real incident and I drove off expecting to read about an armed raid in the newspaper next day.
The police have to train of course, and I’m glad they do. They’re welcome to dance in my driveway with howitzers if they need to.
I was simply surprised that there was not a sign in the main-road saying ‘Police Training’.
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Hi get it right, this is the first time that i have complained about the police in the paper. And i was there and i know that no signs were displayed. I totally agree that the police have to train but the way that they went about this exercise was totally the wrong way. And actually for all your information i do actually think that the police do a good job. and yes i will carry on whinging if i see fit to do so.
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How unbelievable. People that weren’t even there that haven’t been subjected to the stress of not knowing whether some nutter was about to jump out with a weapon and shoot them, maybe just for the hell of it, seem to know exactly what went on. Billythefish and Paul Le Page, you’re just ignorant. How come there are so many arrogant, opinionated Guerns around?? Of course, you all knew it was just an exercise, and there was nothing to be concerned about. Wind your necks in and give someone who happened to get caught in the wrong place at the wrong time in the TOTALLY WRONG circumstances a bit of consideration. Any exercise which could endanger or upset members of the general public should have a suitable risk assessment carried out before hand, and if it needs to be done in a public place, should ensure that unknowing members of the general public are aware they are entering into a training exercise area. The Police close off roads any other time they feel the need, so why wasn’t it done for this. Someone must have known that the location of the “target” in advance, so why not close off the area to the general public 15 mins before? No reason needs to be given, as is the case when there is a serious accident or some other incident, and it’s not like it is hard, just requires a bit of thought. I’m not police bashing, I think they do a good job on the whole, but this was a PREPLANNED EXERCISE and some more thought should have been given to cover the “Law of Unforeseen consequences”. I don’t object to live training exercises, but they have to be conducted in a safe and appropriate manner.
In the UK there are armed police walking the streets, walking through airports, train and tube stations. They don’t generally walk round pointing their guns at people though, and while that is easier for most people to accept, some people just don’t like guns….
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me
First time you’ve complained about the police?
You seemd to have a bit of a moan about them in the GP on 8th October 2007
http://www.thisisguernsey.com/2007/10/08/we-didnt-pocket-big-kids-money/
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How unbelievable, unbelievable!
It sounds as though there was a risk assessment, given their actions on the day as reported.
As I already said, I’ve been overtaken by three cars going so fast my car shook as they went. You shouldn’t close a road, as it would make the scenario less realistic.
So, no, not arrogant, been “subjected” to it myself. And no-one “pointed a gun” at Ms Troth, she was overtaken by cars (!) and SAW officers with guns. Exactly like at Gatwick.
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Unbelievable – I WAS in the area and I saw signs! In fact I am not sure how Ms Troth missed them – unless she wasn’t paying attention to the road whilst driving.
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Signage springs to mind at least they had the foresight to ensure no bullets were present.
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billythefish you were there were you, well let me tell you firstly the police did not overtake me, i pulled over to let them pass which they did not do. they just screeched to a halt in front of my car. Secondly there were no signs of any nature in the direction that i was travelling. I also understand that another car behind me did not see any signs at all, so maybe both of us were not paying attention. Or was it really the fact that there were none and the police are trying to say that there were. And thirdly i did have the guns pointed at me which i totally object to. Yes places in the uk have armed police officers but how many of these officers actually go around pointing them at the general public. Apart from one other car that came down that way and quickly reversed out of the area their was nobody else about, apart from the police officers doing their training. I can only assume that you must be one of them. And if you are then that just proves to me one thing. They know they messed up this exercise and you no doubt know too. At the end of the day i was there and i know what happened.
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Not only arrogant, but stupid as well, unless of course you happen to be one of the officers involved, at which point I might suggest you are a liar as well. Two members of the public in the vicinity of this part of the exercise say there were no signs up. Great idea to put them up down at L’Eree and hold it somewhere miles away. You must be dense. As far as realism is concerned, driving past other unsuspecting vehicles at high speed on a (relatively) narrow road seems stupid as well. If you want to carry out that sort of training, there are perfectly good race tracks in the UK, an hour or so flight from Guernsey. Again, why risk the safety of the general public unnecessarily. What say for instance, the women present was deaf, had not heard the sirens and had actually stopped for a small child running into the road? If the police had killed that child would you be so blaise? What would you do if it happened to be a close friend or family member of yours? Bet it would be a bit different then eh? Training exercises should be conducted in suitable training areas with VOLUNTEERS not unsuspecting members of the public, all the other emergency services do… St Johns, firefighters, airport security, why should the police have a different set of rules for their training?
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HHmmmm…. Well, Me, I’m not sure you would have noticed the signs seeing as you have managed to mis-read what’s been written here, and also that you appear to now tell a different story to that attributed to you in the Press.
Firstly, I did not say there were signs there. I didn’t even say I was there!!! I said there were at Pleinmont when I got caught up in an exercise. That said, Eh above said that there were indeed signs up on the day you refer to.
Secondly, you are reported as being overtaken by police cars and seeing officers with guns. Now you are saying you pulled in and had them screech to a halt and point guns at you. Which is it Me?
You know, seeing as you’ve made a number of errors just in reading what’s been written here, I have to doubt what actually took place that day….
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Chill out Unbelievable – if someone decides to “go public” and share their experiences and opinions with the local media they are inviting public comment, which is exactly what has happened here. This is after all a forum for opinion!
As for your accusations, how is it ignorant to read an article, take note of what measures the police had taken and conclude, in my opinion and all things considered, that they were reasonable, or to note that police in the UK and other jurisdictions carry guns?
How is it arrogant to observe other peoples’ reaction to this particular lady and her alleged persistent complaints whilst noting that I myself had not seen any and therefore commented on this article solely on its own merit?
Opinionated and arrogant? Well guilty as charged on the first one but on this occasion not guilty on the second, I think. I’m not too proud to admit error though, so feel free to correct me if you wish.
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@me
why didn’t you mention the guns being pointed to you during your report to the GP?
That seems like a pretty major factor. IN FACT If this was the case that is totally unacceptable and I would do more than complain to the GP. I would ask that a full investigation takes place into why they thought it necessairy to point a gun at a member of the general public. I would think that would have made the front page headline.
I can’t help but think your statement is changing according to the comments being posted on here.
If you are the woman in question, Debbie Troth, then you have complained about the police to the GP before and you have also made another complaint regarding …a fence was it? You can’t blame the posters on here for being a bit skeptical about your claims…me thinks you like the sound of your own er…voice in writing?
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Dave i did tell the press that the guns had been pointed at me. i also told the news channels too. I have no control of how the press print their stories and do feel annoyed that they missed this point out. Apologies to you Billythefish if i misread what you wrote. If it had been as simple as the police passing me and doing their training i don’t think that i would have complained. So i will print what actually took place. I was on my way home driving through route de talbots and i saw a car parked further down the road on the opposite side. As i approached this car Three police cars came speeding along in the opposite direction with their sirens going and blue lights flashing. I pulled over onto the pavement to allow them to pass this parked car and get to where they were going. Obviously thinking they were on an emergency somewhere. As they got near the parked car the first car screached to a halt parking diagonally in front of my car. They other two stopped their cars alongside and behind the parked car so that it was cornered . The police officers then proceeded to clamber out of their cars with their guns. pointing them at my car the parked car whilst other officers were pointing them at the trees and the shruberry in the fields. As i tried to reverse my vehicle one of the officers kept pointing the gun towards my car. which to put it clearly was petrifying. At no stage did any of the officers approach me and tell me they were training, there were no signs displaying this anywhere along the route that i travelled. No officers were wearing any vests stating that it was a training exercise. The officer pointing the gun could clearly see that i was scared but did not say anything. Now like i have said i have no objections to police training exercises, and i do feel that they do a good job. But in this case i feel they were in the wrong. I do not see that any police officer has the right to point a gun at anybody in a training exercise. And i also am led to believe that when in training they are not supposed to exceed the speed limit they can only do this in an emergency. So now i have put what actually happened and you can read for yourself i am sure that like me you could have been led to believe that this was a real life incident. How was i to know that they were training. So if all the other commenters feel that it is ok to go around pointing guns at people then you are all just as stupid as they are.
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And yes Dave i complained about my fence, and why was that. I don’t really care what people think about me. The fence was to do with my little boy who i must add has a profound hearing loss. So if it upsets the people of Guernsey that i want to protect my child and make sure that he is safe then that is their problem. I have lost two children and do not relish the thought of losing another child. So before you harp on about the fence try reading the story as to why first. Maybe you are another one of the ignorant guernsey people who think that wearing hearing aids restores the hearing. if so then read up on deafness and get to know somebody with a hearing loss and then you will understand why i complained.. urmm now what can i complain about next.
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Guernsey Police you done goofed, the consequences will never be the same.
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Now for the apologies…..
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unbelievable… Apologies, i don’t think so. I wouldn’t expect an apology from a Guern. I notice how quickly the comments stopped when i put what actually happened. This goes to prove that they like me realise that maybe just maybe i was right on this one. These are narrow minded Guernsey Folk they don’t apologise. They all hide behind aliases as they are too afraid to say who they are. Maybe this is one of the real reasons that this island is in such a state as no one has the balls to stand up for what they believe in. Whimps the majority of them. PERIOD…………………
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no – just no one can be ars*d to argue with you.
What’s the point? no one ever wins.
I’ll take what you say with a large bucket of salt if you don’t mind.
Ta very muchly.
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All sounds like a load of tripe to me.
Maybe the two complainers believe all training should be carried out in a totally sterile environment? Clueless….
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Exactly like Dave said ‘me’ no-one can be ars*d to listen you anymore! boy that cried wolf ring any bells?!
and FYI not everyone that posts on this forum are ‘narrow minded Guernsey Folk’ – be careful what insults you dish out on here as everyone does know who you are and have your full name even if they dont.. or had you forgotten that within all the lies?
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She should count herself lucky she lives in such a peaceful Island with well equipped services on hand so any real threat is dealt with quickly & efficiently. Maybe a few weeks in Afghanistan or Iraq would make her think long & hard about how fortunate she & her offspring truly are.
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training is learning from experience.. And I for one don’t want any coppers running around with real guns and no experience ???.. That’s how accidents happen and training is the only way to get experience
But hopefully they will have learnt something from this excise… rattle your piggy bank and BUY SOME WARNING SIGNS.
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