I’m glad PC resigned
Wednesday 18th March 2009, 2:30PM GMT.
A GUERNSEY woman assaulted by a police officer is elated that he has been forced to resign from the force.
Rosemarie Holt, 64, was left traumatised after she was handcuffed and ordered into a police van by PC Stuart Allan, with no reason given, just over a year ago.
‘I feel like a huge weight has been lifted off my shoulders. It’s wonderful.
‘I was worried it was going to be hanging over me for the rest of my life,’ said Mrs Holt, a mother-of-four and former Swissville nanny.
She said the result had gone some way to restoring her faith in the police force and hoped it meant all officers would not be tarred with the same brush.
‘I was frightened because I thought, if he gets away with it, I probably would have felt like leaving the island. I would have always been scared of coming face to face with him,’ she said.
Mrs Holt said PC Allan wanted her to forget about the incident.
‘He thought I was just a quiet, stupid Guernsey woman but I really felt that I didn’t want this to happen to other women, especially my grandchildren,’ said Mrs Holt.
The incident, which happened on 1 March last year, left the grandmother-of-eight with bleeding wrists.
Mrs Holt had been pulled over halfway along Fort Road and ordered out of the car by PC Allan.
The officer suspected that she had been drink-driving – which she had not – and that she had driven over a white line on North Esplanade.
Mrs Holt was handcuffed, without being arrested or asked for a breath sample.
She was released without charge.
PC Allan was initially found guilty of assault in the Magistrate’s Court and fined £250.
He appealed the conviction, but that was thrown out of the Royal Court.
Guernsey Police confirmed a police disciplinary hearing was convened on Monday, chaired by a senior police officer from a UK police force.
Having heard evidence presented, the constable appearing before the hearing was ‘required to resign’.
‘There is an appeals process available and we would not wish to comprise that by commenting further,’ said Inspector Trevor Coleman for the Guernsey Police.
Mrs Holt said she was never interested in compensation – only justice for what had happened to her.
‘It wasn’t ever about that. I wanted it for future generations so that young people can look up to police,’ she said.
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I’m impressed this lady stood her ground and proved the complaints system works.
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Onya Babe, I’m right behind you
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Well done Guernsey Police.
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Has anyone actually been out with the police to see what they have to put up with ?
The Police do a fantastic job… greatly underpaid compared to their Jersey colleagues.
Who else would like to be abused.. both verbally and physically every day.. confronting knife weilding low lifes…clean up human excrement, yes they do do that !!! amongst other degrading stuff… Give them the pay, the respect that they deserve. PC Stuart Allen should not have been forced to resign.. Good Luck Stu !!
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>>Who else would like to be abused.. both verbally and physically every day<<
Judging by some of the comments on this website, most of our States Members.
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This seems like a storm in a teacup. This woman was driving erratically and then according to the magistrate failed to co-operate with the police officer and became hysterical. He exercised his discretion not to arrest her (which he had ground to do on the basis of her non-cooperation) and this is what he gets for his pains. This has been a ridiculous waste of public money and for what? An officer trying to do his job has had his career ruined. And all because a woman could not admit that she behaved unreasonably in ignoring police flashing lights, failing to co-operate and becoming hysterical.
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Before people judge the officer, they should ensure they are in possession of the full facts of the case. The officer decided, as a gesture of goodwill to the woman, not to arrest her for failing to provide a sample of breath or for behaving in a disorderly manner. Ironically, had he arrested her, he would not have been liable for assault on her as the arrest would have provided him with the power in law to use force. This sets a precident, where officers in the future might be less likely to exercise discretion for fear of falling foul of the law when they are lenient rather than making an arrest. So, the public who are elated at this hearing and result, should consider the knock on effect this will have for the PCs fellow officers and their dealings with the public. This is not a day of triumph for the police, or the public.
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I agree the police have a very difficult job and the ever increasing political correctness which this society is adopting is making their lives difficult. They are damned if they do and damned if they don’t.
Let’s look at this from a different perspective. If the woman in question had been drinking would this officer have still been disciplined and lost his job? They have to make split second decisions and this case is not going to encourage any youngsters to join the police force. Perhaps the police should send all officers out in two’s – that way they will not be put in such a position again. It seems the officer handcuffed her because she was becoming agitated. The reason her wrists were bleeding was also an indication of her agitation as she must have been struggling hard to try and wriggle her hands out of them.
I have been stopped by the police randomly: they were only doing their job and i co-operated and then was able to get on my way. No doubt if i started arguing then i would raise suspicion and i would expect to be arrested for further questioning.
I wonder if this woman is pleased that she has cost this young man his job? He never denied that he had handcuffed her and arrested her for her own safety – just that he had forgotten to caution her. He could have lied and then it would have been his word against hers (and most magistrates tend to believe the police in this instance). He did not – he admitted he had made a mistake and was vilified for it.
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(and most magistrates tend to believe the police in this instance). Ah so the police can lie knowing that their word is more believable than the public eh ? surley proof is needed to convict ?.Saying that, I think the police have one of the hardest jobs to do and this officer should not lose his job. Get him back !
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It does appear as a simple error of judgement. We all make them from time to time and simply apologise and that’s that.
It seems strange and harsh that a simple mistake with procedure has cost this man his position.
There are many ailments that affect different peoples lives nowadays. Nobody can be expected to be 100% correct all of the time. It comes hand in hand with dealing with different individuals.
She has received an apology. That should have been the end of it.
If the officer had been with a colleague it probably would have been a different outcome. A simple clash of personalities would have been overcome with the second officer stepping in and taking the lead and the heat out of the simple situation.
We all do or can expect to be stopped at some time in our lives. Its what makes our roads and community a safer place to live within.
I don’t think this is a good outcome at all. It will leave many more officers with a sense of paranoia when they are working alone.
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Our police officers ought to have to do a stint in a big UK city, then they’d see what it was like to be placed in a dangerous position. Dealing with toe-rags outside Vlade’s is hardly difficult, althought the way some people go on about their “lot” you’d think that the Police over here were rushed off their feet. You only have to read the weekend stats in the Press on a Monday, usually a few arrests for disorderly conduct, a drink driving etc etc, it’s hardly serious offences most of the time. But then again if they admitted they’ve got a cushy number perhaps they wouldn’t retain their unbelievable pension arrangements.
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The reason a police officer’s word is believed in court is that polices officers are sworn in when they become police officers. So they are considered to be under oath at all times.
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Its a sad state of affairs that has been whipped up by sensationalism in the media – and for whatever reason-maybe her 15 mins of fame, this lady has decided to create a mountain out of mole hill – happily assisted by the Press – journalists and editors should hang their heads in shame!
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Pete
And the reason they’re often not believed by the public is due to a significant number of people having experienced their “evidence” which can frequently turn out to be untruthful.
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I assume the fact that he was forced to resign by his superiors meant that he had acted inappropriately?
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Phil, Guernsey is not a big UK city, but it doesn’t mean that we don’t have a bunch of idiots living amongst us who continue cause major irritation whether it be drunk, disorderly, causing criminal damage or whatever.
Also I am not sure whether you are implying that drink driving is not a serious crime. These people should be fined much more heavily and taken off the roads for longer – just my opinion. In general, the consequences of crime are pathetically weak on this island.
I agree with SDG, Neil, Paul, etc on this. I think PC Allan’s misjudgement has been blown out of context. This media reporting of the affair has benefited no-one, including Mrs Holt. Her quotes are just wet.
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Russ
What I meant about drink driving is that it’s hardly comparable to rapes, stabbings, shootings etc that happen on a near daily basis in some UK cities.
Also, our punishments for drink driving are harsher than almost any other western country as far as I’m aware, as are those for drug offences and, for that matter, relatively minor offences like disorderly conduct. Where are you comparing Guernsey to if you think our sentences are pathetically weak?
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I have seem a first hand what the police have to deal with on the Council Estates.. by those people that we tax payers pay their hard earned money to… so that thy can drink smoke it away… or (as you will see around town early on Saturday mornings)…. thrown up in the street… then then they cause the police yet more trouble by attacking then with knives baseball bats and such like.. Get rid of the scum and scroungers of Guernsey..and the rest of us can live safely and in a decent place once more… and the police can do the job that they signed up for.
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I totally disagree with you Phil. Drink Driving is as dangerous as stabbings, shootings etc as these drunks are in charge of a dangerous weapon i.e. a car.
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I wouldn’t disagree Phil and I speak from personal experience (not on the receiving end mind you). But I just made the point that the police are considered to be under oath at all times.
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Two things from my perspective.
1 – Police Officers have a job that no one would want; poor pay, sweeping up idiots, violence, domestic abuse, sudden deaths, complaints, verbal abuse, awful shift patterns, stress, isolation from society etc. So lets face it, the job is hard work.
2 – Stuart Allan is lucky he did not get sent to prison, or receive a suspended sentence for assault. Police are allowed to use force only if the individual has been arrested and further more, if they consider the offender to be a threat to themselves, the public or the Police Officer. For a 64 year old woman to be a threat to a male Police Officer who is obvioulsy fitter and stronger she would have to be weilding a weapon and not just being verbally objectionable. What Allan did was assault this woman without due cause and he acted contrary to the law.
He got off lightly and was fortunate.
Would you want your mother or grandparents to go through the same thing?
Being handcuffed is not something I would recommend to anyone – it takes away you liberty, dignity and also hurts a great deal.
The only defence he would have had in these circumstances in my view if, given that there were no witnesses and therefore no bystanders, was to state in his notebook, if it indeed was the case, that she was mentally unstable and he considered she would do harm – however he would need to arrest her first before he touched her, unless she or he was in imminent danger.
I think the Police should be applauded in this particular case.
Remember – how would you like to be treated?
It is easy to pontificate from a keyboard, or a chair in a courtroom, but ultimately it is about applying common sense.
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Merlin
I really can’t see how your argument holds water. How on earth can you possibly say that drink driving is comparable to shootings, stabbings, rapes etc? The fundamental point is intent, a typical drink driver has no intent whatsoever of harming anyone, and if they did then they would be charged with a more serious offence than simple drink driving. I realise that harm is sometimes done by drink drivers but it is not intentional harm, whereas someone who stabs, shoots, or rapes somebody has hardly done it unintentionally have they?
I do not condone drink driving but I often think that the punishments dished out are harsh when compared to other motoring offences such as dangerous driving. Let’s face it, a person who can hold their drink would (in my view) be more in control of their 35mph vehicle after 2 beers than a stone cold sober reckless driver would be whilst driving at 70mph in a 35mph zone. That’s just my opinion though.
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The Police Officer lost his career. I will be accutely aware of that if I ever need to request police assistance. There is one less on the street to look after our community. This is a witch hunt.
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PC ALLAN FOUND GUILTY OF ASSAULT FINED £250
JO BLOGGS ASSAULT ON POLICE FINED £750 AND PRISON TIME.
I THINK PC ALLAN GOT OFF VERY LIGHTLY.
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The questions I would ask the defenders of this gentleman, and I use the word ironically, are:
Did any of you actually witness this incident?
If not, why are you taking the police’s version of the truth as absolute fact and by default calling this lady a liar?
Are you saying that it’s ok for a man to brutalise a woman (generally considered a taboo in most civilised societies) as long as he’s wearing a uniform and ‘thinks’ (wrongly, it turns out) that she may be breaking the law?
and last, but certainly not least, how would you really feel if this had happened to you or your elderly mother?
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Scarlett
As a matter of interest did you witness the incident?
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The only thing this police officer did wrong was to not formally ‘arrest’ the woman prior to handcuffing her – which he admitted (was he relatively new to the job)? If police cars had cameras in, like they do in the UK, then this incident would have been taped and it would have been evident as to whether the driver of the car was driving erratically or not. However, for someone to drive from the North Esplanade all the way up the Val de Terres and halfway along Fort road with a police car behind them with the blues and twos going and not stopping would surely have raised concern among any other police officer? The fact that she was 64 years of age does not mean she was not capable of becoming aggressive or hysterical and therefore a danger to herself (which perhaps was why she was handcuffed)? I admit I would hate it to happen to me and who knows how i would react in the same situation.
I thought police officers always went around in two’s – is this not the case anymore? This PC apologised and should perhaps have been given a warning and retraining – but to lose his job was rather harsh in my view – but I am a forgiving character.
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