‘Soup kitchen’ plan means retire at 67
Sunday 2nd August 2009, 11:46AM BST.
THE pension age will rise to 67. 
It was part of a package of proposals by the Social Security Department to ensure its funds remained healthy.
But there were acrimonious scenes as the States debated Social Security’s plans, with Treasury minister Charles Parkinson warning they could create a ‘soup kitchen society’.
Most of the recommendations went through, but the Assembly rejected its proposal to increase the contribution rate for employers by 0.5% from 1 January and for a guaranteed grant from general revenue to replace the current arrangement.
The pension age will go up annually from 2020 by two months until 2032.
A war of words broke out in the chamber between Treasury minister Charles Parkinson and his Social Security counterpart, Mark Dorey.
Deputy Parkinson said the proposals could make Guernsey unattractive to management level individuals. They also risked driving rich people from the island by changing the upper-earnings limits and contribution rates, he said.
‘If they go, they not only take with them their contributions to Social Security but also their income tax and their enterprise,’ said Deputy Parkinson.
The upper-earnings limits would be around double those in Jersey and he urged the Assembly to throw out the proposals entirely.
‘No thought has been given to what the employers’ contributions should be – there is no evidence to suggest they tested employers’ contributions in any meaningful way. Simply asking employers what they want to pay is, I think, pointless,’ said Deputy Parkinson.
He added the report could create a ‘soup kitchen society’, where lower income individuals would rely on government handouts, giving over their hard-earned cash before having to ask for it back in the form of benefits, and only receiving it if they were deemed sufficiently needy.
Deputy Dorey said the comment highlighted the totally different ethos between the departments.
Several meetings with Treasury had taken place and its members had made no indication of their displeasure until 10 May.
‘Our members were shocked by what Treasury and Resources members said then and there was disbelief at the level of inconsistency,’ said Deputy Dorey.
Social Security had spent two years, thousands of pounds, and used up many man-hours doing what the States had asked it to do and to reject the proposals now would be totally irresponsible, he said.
n Deputy Matt Fallaize accused Deputy Parkinson of unloading his frustration at being the Treasury minister responsible for seeing through a zero-10 system he never supported by attacking Social Security.
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What about people working in the trade how can you expect some one of that age to be carrying blocks around or plastering houses or any other heavy work job its ok for people working in offices where its nice and warm how about giving a thought for the every day person that does manual work they wont make it to there retirement at this rate
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The more and more stories we hear about this particular states, I get a picture in my head similar to end of a Benny Hill episode, except without the scantily clad ladies.
Except this tit for tat nonsense is having a massive effect on the average guern.
What saddens me is they push this proposal through which is a MASSIVE change for the average worker, yet are using it as an oppurtunity to fire barbs at each other.
Sickening!
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This will not be affecting me because I am a Guern…
You see us Guernsey folk that have been born & bred Guerns are beind driven from this island we call home, therefore by the time I am 67 I will be long gone, never to return…
I have said it for a while now but I am moving away with my family – we are just saving up… The states keep on making it hard to save but we will get there…
You will not beat me Parkinson…. You & your States buddies may get the last laugh – filling your coffers with our hard earned money so you can squander it on rubbish but I dont care…
If driving out us young Guerns is what you are trying to achieve them well done – give yourself a big hug… you have succeeded…
For the very first time in my life I am becoming increasingly ashamed to be a part of this island & its corrupt ways… We are an absolute sham, being run by a bunch of fools, determined to ruin Guernsey & its wonderful history!!
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Yep The Man – A massive change for the average worker.
No change whatsoever for the lazy scroungers who will continue to stay at home watching Jeremy Kyle on their widescreen TV’s, emailing from their laptops or texting each other to compare their new tattoos and piercings on the latest mobile phone. Apart from Thursday when they’ll be tripping over each other to be front of the queue with hands outstretched grabbing their dole money cos they get more than they would to work.
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Any states member out there prepared to divulge how many states members who voted to put the retirement age up will actually be working longer as a result of their decision? Not many I bet.
Comments from any deputy welcome.
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Kevin,
I am one States member who will still be some way from my 65th birthday by the time the pensionable age increases to 67.
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never mind putting the age up to 67 how about bringing it down to 60 and then if you want to work longer to keep all these youngsters that wont work or keep having babys so they dont have to its up to you .i think the states memberes thrive on people moaning ,so they can see how and with what they can wind up people with next ,
get a states run cresh and make all these youngsters work now and save a fortune,states members should be thinking like in the uk at the moment wont work no money simple as that
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Well said John. Our States members should be doing exactly that. I have voted in the past but I’d certainly think twice before voting next time. The States do not care about the people of Guernsey unless you don’t want to work or keep popping out babies that is.
I think you’d find that if the age was brought down to 60, with the option of working til 67 to support the scroungers, there wouldn’t be a herd of people rushing to do so. I’m sure the States members of course would have no problem with doing just that!
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Well this just proves that the majority of the current States are totally out of touch with the public the supposedly represent. When will they start to listen???
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Does anybody know how many contributions are needed for a full pension
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Matt Fallaize
With respect I didn’t ask for individual deputies to say when they retire. Just a straight answer to a straight question will do. How many deputies who voted to raise retirement age will be affected by the rise in retirement age e.g. work longer. If you were older and seen your final salary pension scheme go pear shaped and then had your retirement plans nailed by the politicians you may think differently.I suspect that a large number of deputies are “old money” and will be sunning themselves in warmer climes whilst I’m still working and putting my wedge into the social insurance fund. I haven’t met anyone yet who would not have paid more to retire at 65. even the chamber of commerce who normally are so far to the right they make Maggie Thatcher look like karl Marks thought paying more was a good option.Sadly as usual it’s the workers at the bottom of the pile who will suffer most.
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I would certainly pay more to get my pension at 65 instead of 67. But we islanders (who the voting deputies are supposed to represent) weren’t properly asked.
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Deputies
where are your replies to my posts?
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I think you are being unfair to the deputies on this one. The pension fund is invested and very few people anticipated the massive loss of interest brought about by the credit crunch which has caused the shortfall.
We were all sent a consultation form. Did you return yours?
There is a very long lead in. You will only have to work longer if you are under 55. If you are 54 you work 2 months longer, if you are 53 you work 4 months longer and so on until those who are 43 now will have to work the extra 2 years
I have some sympathy for manual workers but they should be fitter than office workers and more likely to benefit from our increased life span. Do they get the St. John Ambulance training on how to lift heavy loads safely?
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Absolute hypocrites they are just heading the UK way- lets take a look at their pension scheme.
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sheila cataroche
what planet are you on?
manual labour e.g. building sites e.t.c. can be extremely hard work. At 5.00p.m the islands gyms are not filled with labourers expending their excess energy they are filled with penpushers who have been sitting in airconditioned offices who have got energy to spare due to the nature of their job.It’s a disgrace to ask manual workers to work until 67.
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Shelia
Unfair to the deputies i agree with Kevin your on another planet.
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I am afraid the States are going to do what they want and not give a dam,as a local person I am furious to what they have done, its all the time they come up with pathetic ways of saving money, if they actually looked at these people claiming benefits and who have not done a days work in their life their would be massive money saved!! Personally I would sack every states member and replace them with a couple of local people with a bit of common sense!!
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