New St Sampson’s High head is named
Wednesday 21st April 2010, 2:29PM BST.
ST SAMPSON’S HIGH has named its new head teacher, who will be taking over in September.
In the school’s monthly newsletter, the present head teacher Hazel Tetlaw, announced her successor would be Annabel Bolt.
Mrs Bolt is currently head teacher at Springhill High School in Rochdale, Lancashire, and she has been there for 13 years.
She will take over from Miss Tetlaw, who is stepping down at the end of the summer term.
In the newsletter, Miss Tetlaw said Mrs Bolt had a great deal of experience in running a school.
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Not to be nasty to Miss Tetlaw but i think this is a good thig for the school, hopefully this new head teacher will find some way to stop all the bulling in the school that Miss Tetlaw refuses to admit goes on there..
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Another non local coming to island !! Im sure there are many Dep Heads that could step up to the role ?
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Thats the best news ive heard all year. I was a pupil at St Sampsons Secondary school with her in charge, and have nothing good to say about her. I was kicked out of school a few months before i would have sat my GCSEs because I lost my temper with a teacher. It was nothing malicious or threatening, just a tantrum and a waltz out of that particular lesson because I felt frustrated at being treated like an eight year old when I was 15, a young man. Fair enough i had caused trouble at the school in the past but that is what teenagerds do. It was second nature, but miss Tetlaw thought it was intolerable and decided to kick me out of school, closing many doors in my future just like that. Because I was acting my age. That is no leader, especially considering how good my predicted GCSE scores were looking. And this is no personal vendetta or grudge. it is the truth. One of my friends was excluded for two weeks because he shaved three skinny lines on his left eyebrow. That is the kind of exaggerated punishments miss Tetlaw was good with, but when it came to bullying she was even more clueless. Four and a half years i spent in that school and bullying was an everyday sight. As for this Mrs Bolt character anyone or anything is better. The bottom line is she didnt care about my future. Now any headteacher with even the smallest ounce of passion in their job would tell you that the future of his or her students is the most important aspect of being a headteacher. Hazel on the other hand would tell you to keep your shirt tucked in or you have no future. I wish her good luck
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David makes an important point.
Time after time we are told how good Guernsey’s teachers’ are. Yet, so often the appointment of Heads come from UK teachers.
Is it that newcomers are easier to control? It can’t be that there are no local candidates who can do the job,or can it be?
What say you Deputy McManus?
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Stephen
Since being elected I have refrained from public comment on education matters and I have had absolutely no involvement in the selection process for the new headteacher at Les Nicolles School.
I wish the new appointee, Mrs Bolt, well in her new post and trust that she will be able to carry the school forward successfully.
You will not be surprised to learn that I would encourage all local employers to adopt and to implement succession planning strategies which foster the training and support required to bring suitable local employees up through the ranks so that they are fully prepared to move into key leadership positions. I do recognise that this is not always possible but I take the view that our community would benefit from local people occupying such key posts.
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Otto Neimanis – When you are at work, if you’ve caused trouble before then one day lose your temper at your boss and storm out, you might well find that you don’t have a job when you decide to come back. If you’re fortunate you may get a second chance, but I wouldn’t risk it too often!
Also, your friend who shaved his eyebrows: if you work somewhere with a specific code of dress, persistent infraction may well result in disciplinary action too. It certainly won’t put you top of the list for promotion.
I agree some school rules may be a bit silly (I don’t see a big deal with shaving lines in eyebrows for example) but they teach us valuable lessons for the future: We can’t always do what we want in this life – sometimes we have to toe the line and do things we think are pointless and silly, or not do things that we don’t see a problem with. They also teach us about respecting authority.
I don’t know the exact details of your situation but to play devil’s advocate for a moment: perhaps it was because Miss Tetlaw did care about your future that she gave those ‘exaggerated punishments.’ OK there may be some debate about their severity but without knowing the full facts, it would not be appropriate to comment.
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Otto, on behalf of all those who have suffered school rules old stylie, corporal punishment, tedious classes, psychotic teachers who would have thrown a large book at your head waay before you threw your tantrum…and are sick of ‘modern’ teenagers bitching and moaning about their rights…
…you don’t know you’re born, dear.
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Otto
Teenagers do not cause trouble by nature, its not something that they do naturally.
Maybe you and your mates do this, but not all of them, you shouldnt tar everyone with the same brush.
Whilst you were causing trouble, and having tantrums, other teenagers were keeping their heads down and trying to learn, and will probably be your boss in 20 years time, are you going to have a tantrum with them too??
And to be fair, a tantrum is something I would have expected even an 8 year old to have grown out of, let aloine a 15 year old, so maybe you werent acting your age, and you certainly werent acting like a young man.
As for them caring about the future…
You have to care about your own future, the teacher will then help you, dont expect them to babysit you to 12 GSCE’s if you have no regard for them.
I know a lot of teachers, and nowadays, given the pathetic protection from dangerous pupils, constant barracking from parents who resent their little brats being told off and constant stripping of their already diminished authority, its a suprise that anyone signs up for the role. So its no surprise that they had to get a good old rochdale lass as headteacher to attempt to bring the place in line. (Which I’m sure GG is well chuffed about)
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I too can’t see the sense in bringing in outsiders to play the role of a headteacher, at least have them sitting as deputy head for a year or two to actually get to know the students… I also think this school needs a male headteacher, no offence to us ladies but I think boys act more responsibly with a male teacher.
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States of Guernsey employment policy requires that all posts must be advertised locally first (take that from someone who’s spent many hours discussing said policy with HR before trying to recruit staff).
If any suitably qualified candidate comes forward, they are appointed.
Seeking candidates from outside of the island is only allowed when this first step fails to identify any suitable candidates.
So if the head teacher has been recruited from the UK, you can safely assume that there were no suitably qualified local candidates.
This tired old myth of passing over locals keeps surfacing. If it really was the case, I’m sure the overlooked local candidates would step forward to complain and their complaints would be upheld.
But they haven’t, because they don’t exist.
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GG – are you sure you werent born in the 1930′s?
If you are indeed 17 and female (highly doubt btw) then are you preparing for life of servitude to your husband?
Give up that part time job (that’s 15 miles away anyway, being a woman you really shouldn’t be on a bike either) and get back in the kitchen woman!
You should really look up “suffragettes”. Many of them fought so that you could have your say (on this forum) so quit trying to drag the rest of us back to the dark ages.
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Why do you doubt I’m a female, it’s my jeans isn’t it?
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Well it really is comforting to hear Miss Tetlaw say that Mrs Bolt “has a great deal of experience in running a school”.
I should hope so, surely even the States wouldn’t be so short sighted to appoint a head teacher who didn’t have any experience.
James…your knowledge of the states policy of employment is unquestionable, however, the question that should be asked is this: Miss Tetlaw has been Head of St Sampsons for a good while now and her retirement should not have come as a suprise to anyone. So why is it that someone (perhaps a deputy head in the same school for common sense and continuity) hadn’t been groomed to take on the role for the past few years leading up to Miss Tetlaws retirement.
That could create a knock on effect where someone lower down the ranks could be groomed to fill the other postion. That way teachers (from the UK or wherever already in Guernsey) gain more “Guernsey” experience and progress into senior postions by virtue of valid local experience.
The way the States appoint a postion such as Head of a school by “importing” a new person when the ability already exists, albeit with a bit of forethought and planning surely can only lead to diminished morale amongst teachers and heads of department.
Schools need continuity to thrive and the current policy of 5 year licences does nothing to create that with teachers coming and going all the time, young uk teachers seem to use Guernsey as a way to gain experience after qualifying and then moving on in 2-3 years or so, it’s high time the States reviewed the policy of 5 year licences for “essential” workers.(essential being teachers/nurses etc Not bank clerks or fund managers)
It may mean that some people stay longer but at least they stay in the same job, no one else is brought in to replace them so the population stays stable, all the nonesense the housing dept. come out with about people coming over being balanced out more or less by people leaving is self deluding, if the peolpe didn;t leave then people wouldn’t have to come to replace them.
Before anyone jumps at me for being xenophobic, I don’t really care where teachers come from but it is important that there is continuity.
When I went to school in the dark ages, the teachers that taught me mostly were still there years after I left and had been there for years before I went to that school.
Otto – You closed the door yourself, you may be taught all sorts about your rights but you have to know when to shup up and listen, flouting the rules is as old as the hills you just gotta know when to stop, stand up and accept the responsibility when it goes wrong do not blame everyone else.
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James. With the greatest of respect, and at the risk of sounding facile, the interview process is mainly subjective, not objective, and there is not a civil servant present at all to ensure that the law you speak of is upheld in the honest (and quite frankly, idealistic) manner you describe.
If any employer would rather employ from the UK than locally (for whatever reasons), all they have to do is interview a few locals, say they weren’t ‘suitable’ (whether they were or not) and then get whoever they like from the UK.
– as for other interviewees complaining, well, they’re not present at all the other interviews to judge whether someone was better than them or not, they’re simply told they didn’t get the job, so how could they complain, exactly?
On another forum I mentioned a builder who has been brought in on licence (bringing his whole family with him) – are you suggesting that there wasn’t a locally qualified person to do that job…?!!
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Scarlett – What you suggest with the licences was true probably a few years ago but not so much these days. I’ve had licences declined where I had given evidence and quite substantial evidence too. Employers now have to go that extra bit further, which I fully applaud by the way. A simple ad in the job centre just won’t do anymore.
I should imagine that builders are brought over here because they can do the job cheaper and probably have a better reputation. Also is the scale of the job up to the local builders? Are they able to commit to long term projects? I don’t think it’s as simple as just being able to build. My neighbour got some UK builders over because they can do the job at about quarter of the price quoted by local firms. Even when you put together expenses that worked out a lot cheaper. And no they’re not Polish… :)
Jimmy – The duration of licences I think has been a debated issue. The reason why it’s 5 years is so the Company has a sufficient amount of time to train up someone locally qualified for the position (although I doubt many employers actually entertain this idea). If we extend to say 7 years there’s a Human Rights element we would have to consider reverting back to the case a couple of years ago that was won. It can also be argued that after 5 years there’s a human rights element.
GG – I’m sure it’s more your genes than your jeans but perhaps you should stop wearing the “boyfriend slouch” style? :)
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thanks for the update, Lynnie – I hope that you’re right – and ref the project concerned, it’s a big build, admittedly, but as for the person concerned being better qualified/cheaper, computer definitely says naaar…!! ;0)
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James – you are right in theory but not in practice – I have experience of the outright breach of these employment rules and did protest and did win – to give credit to Pat Mellor she took the case up and that was a great help in stopping the case from being covered up.
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Lynnie
A quarter of the price? If someone quoted me a quater of the price i`d have been very suspicious.
Surely thats a mistake?
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I agree Scarlett, there are people here working as painter and decorators and doing various work in the building trade ,living here on a 5 year licence,what is all that about.
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bcb – I can only go on what she told me I’m afraid. She may have exagerated the point but I don’t doubt that it was cheaper. The work they’re doing looks ok and they seem to be doing a good job at waking me up at 7.30am on a Saturday
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valeite
We have a government in denial on such issues, I can only imagine our politicians consider it political suicide to try to address the growing population and licence issue. Lip service is all we get.
Dave Jones told me recently that such licences are only issued to worker considered essential, and that it wasnt a big problem. I know he is busy but im looking forward to further comments from him and others when the opportunity arises.
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Importing a foreigner again, because obviously there are no qualified, experienced local teachers who know island culture and who would be much more suitable for the role than someone who has probably never even heard of our island!
Otto, if you ever do get a job, you will find that shouting at your boss and “waltzing out” will get you the sack. To anyone with a brain, teenage or not, having a toddler-tantrum is not “second nature”.
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It does not surprise me at all that a number of posters have already reverted to the ‘import’ complaints again.
It’s such a shame there are so many stubborn Guerns in Guernsey, who can’t see beyond the end of their stubby noses, ay. I for one would happily see every small minded Guern shipped off this island, and replaced by more capable English, French, American, Latvian, Polish people. That way, us rather more accepting Guerns can live here proudly without the need to listen to constant moaning from our peers who think the rest of the world is a nasty place full of nasty people who have no right to ‘invade’ us.
Good luck Mrs Bolt. Trust me, your biggest challenge is going to be overcoming the resistance to you because you are English. I hope you manage to find a way to ignore those who are not intelligent enough to look at your abilities rather than your birthplace.
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Truth Man. Instead of telling us all how intelligent and superior you are, how about proving it by making your point without the arrogant, derogatory and sweeping statements which proves you are otherwise?
In the US, the ‘race card’ is so often played that the country has become paranoid about appearing to be racist, and I am sure some employers quake in their boots at the thought of turning down an african american for a job on the basis they’ll find themselves the victim of a law suit.
– all that said, there is absolutely no doubt that some racism still exists.
Your argument appears to be that EVERYONE who doesn’t blithely accept that ANYONE can be imported into the island to work from ANYWHERE, for whatever reason, is a small minded ‘racist’…
so, do you propose that we adopt the UK’s open door immigration policy, which is pretty much what Jersey did?
Well, that’s working out just great for them over there, isn’t it? Or do you not read the news?
Perhaps the reason so many local people complain about imports is because they have a point. Perhaps they DO read the news, and don’t want Guernsey turning into another Little Britain – as you do.
Perhaps it’s because they are sick and tired of the personal experiences they’ve had of people being imported for entirely non essential reasons (like builders and decorators on 5 year licences, we haven’t got enough of those, ay…?) and object to the additional pressure this puts on our over burdened infrastructure that WE pay for, and perhaps it’s this consistent flaunting of the laws that the rest of us have to abide by that gets right up their collective noses.
It certainly gets up mine.
Maybe they were right to import this Head, but as they knew that Miss Tetlaw was due for retirement, maybe they could have given someone here a chance to move up the ranks, thus allowing someone else to do likewise.
The fact is, we shall never know for sure, but this I do know, if you think the worst thing this new Head will be facing is the fact she’s English, then you are way more ignorant than your fellow countrymen, as you evidentially know nothing about St Sampson’s High.
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…and whilst I think of it, Truth Man, perhaps you’d like to go to Jersey, and share your ‘right on’ liberal views with the parents of the young female nursery worker, who, when walking home some years ago, was attacked by an ‘imported’ laborer.
When he couldn’t rape her, he killed her.
He’d been in the island 6 whole weeks.
His employers, who weren’t held in any way accountable, failed to conduct any Police checks, which would have revealed that he was a violent psychopath.
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has everyone except Lynnie completely missed GG’s first comment here?????
GG you comments are always inaccurate and offensive but this one really tips the bucket!
Sexist, racist and a bigot all in 5 lines! – seriously think about what you have written and think about the year we are living in (2010 in case you haven’t cottoned on).
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Scarlett
You are right on a number of levels;
Immigration should not be made into an issue about racism. There are those on here who seem to think it ok to twist every issue in this direction, some appearing racist some clearly not.
This appointment may have been appropriate but if thats the case then we as an Island are most likely failing to bring on, the personnel we already have. This was hardly a surprise vacancy.
this Island has a virtual open door policy already, but there seems no political will to do anything about it.
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Jo, I’m not inaccurate babe, you are.
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I personally don’t see any racism, sexism or biggotry in any of GG’s posts. She seems like a respectable and well knowledged lass, much more sensible than I was at her age!
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Truth Man
Americans? Please dont start bringing them in :)
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Scarlett:
I just happen to think those who automatically jump on the import bandwagon are narrow minded and lack the intelligence to look beyond nationality (or perhaps they are simply too stubborn to admit that we do need to import skills). Does that make me believe I am more intelligent than those people? In some ways, yes it does. However in many respects I just think I am rather more broad minded on this subject. But I most certainly don’t think I am superior at all.
Do you honestly believe one is superior to another based purely on levels of intelligence? Your post suggests so, and in which case it says more about you than it does about me.
Also, your second post is odd, and I wonder if I’ve misunderstood you. You seem to suggest that because an ‘import’ in Jersey killed a local girl, I should not be so vocal with my opinion. Is this because all ‘imports’ should be tarred with the same brush in case they are as bad?
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bcb:
Sorry, I did go too far didn’t I!
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Scarlett:
I just read your last paragraph again.
You believe St Sampson’s High is worse for an experienced teacher than the treatment she is likely to receive from locals because she is non-local? You have clearly not seen UK schooling in full swing and you have clearly not been sighted on the way non-locals are made to feel thoroughly unwelcome by people such as some of those who post on this site.
Are you ignorant, or am I? It doesn’t matter to me enough to argue about as this is just my opinion, and your post is just yours.
Perhaps we could both learn a lot from Voltaire?
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The following story adapted from a post by jimbns on manxforums.com tends to fit in with Guernsey’s apparent obsession with recruiting and promoting outsiders to help run the island
REST OF THE WORLD VERSION
The squirrel works hard in the withering heat all summer long,building and improving his house and laying up supplies for the winter.The grasshopper thinks he must be mad and laughs and dances and plays the summer away.
Come winter the squirrel is warm and well fed.The shivering grasshopper has no food or shelter and dies out in the cold. THE END
THE PROBABLE GUERNSEY VERSION A FEW YEARS HENCE AS A RESULT OF CONTINUED IMMIGRATION
The squirrel,introduced into the island via the powers vested in themselves by the O.U.R to balance the hedgehog and rabbit near monopoly,works hard in the withering heat all summer long,building and improving his house and laying up supplies for the winter.The grasshopper thinks he must be mad and laughs and dances and plays the summer away.
Come winter the squirrel is warm and well fed.
A former Labour Council social worker finds the shivering grasshopper,calls a press conference and demands to know why the squirrel should be allowed to be warm and well fed while others less fortunate,such as the grasshopper,are cold and starving.
Channel TV provides live coverage of the shivering grasshopper,with cuts to a video clip of the squirrel in his comfortable warm home and a table laden with food.
In his Voice of the People column the Press editor informs his readers that they should be ashamed that in an island of such wealth this poor grasshopper is allowed to suffer while others have so much.
The newly formed Green Party,Greenpeace,Animal Rights and the Grasshopper Social Housing Committee demonstrate in front of the squirrel’s house.
Channel TV interrupts a cultural festival special with the breaking news and broadcasts a multicultural choir rendition of ‘We shall overcome’from North Beach.
A local socialist rants on in an interview with Richard Murphy that the squirrel got rich legally but immorally off the backs of downtrodden Third World grasshoppers and calls for an immediate tax hike on the squirrel to make him pay his fair share and demands a further rise in the rate of Tax on Real Property on all squirrels’ homes in the island.
In response to pressure from the media,the Guernsey Assembly drafts the Economic Equity and Grasshopper Anti Discrimination Act with orders to the Crown Officers to drop all other legislation in order to bring it in immediately and to make it retroactive to the beginning of the summer.
The squirrel’s taxes are re-assessed upwards.He is summoned to Court and fined heavily for failing to hire five year licence holding grasshoppers to carry out the building work at his home,and given a twelve hour community sentence for contempt when he told the Court that the grasshopper did not want to work.
Meanwhile the grasshopper is given a States house,financial aid to furnish it and an account with a local taxi firm to ensure that he can be socially mobile.
The squirrel’s excess food is seized and re-distributed to the more needy members of society,in this case the grasshopper.
Without enough money to buy more food,to pay off the fine and the higher taxes,the squirrel is forced to downsize and start building a new home. Unfortunately he faces many months delay while he seeks planning permission for his non-glass and steel abode.
Housing takes over his old house and utilises it as a temporary home for asylum seeking cats who had hijacked a plane to get to Guernsey as they previously had to share their own country with mice.On arrival they attempted to blow up Guernsey airport because of the islanders apparent love of dogs.
The cats were arrested for the hijacking offence and the attempted bombing but were immediately released after the Police had fed them tuna rather than salmon whilst in custody.Initial moves to repatriate them to their country of origin were abandoned when the cats made it clear that they could face death by the mice on their return.
The cat’s are provided with emergency accommodation and immediately turn to pickpocketing in Church Square and start up a scam to relieve locals of money from their credit cards.
Meanwhile a CTV special shows the grasshopper finishing up the last of the squirrel’s food,though Spring is still many months away, while the States house he is in crumbles around him because he has not bothered to demand free repairs.He is caught on camera taking legal highs.
Inadequate States funding is blamed for the grasshopper’s decline into drugs.
The cats seek recompense from the Royal Court for their treatment since their arrival in Guernsey.
The grasshopper is arrested for stabbing an elderly dog during a burglary to get money for his growing drug habit.He is imprisoned but released immediately because he has already been on remand for a few days.He is placed in the care of the probation service to monitor and supervise his future behaviour,but within a few weeks he kills a Guinea Pig in a botched robbery in the dark and secluded lane leading to St Sampsons High.
A commission of enquiry believed to cost in the region of £250,000 is set up to state the bleeding obvious and additional money is put in to fund a legal high rehabilitation scheme for grasshoppers.
Legal aid for Advocates representing asylum seekers goes through the roof and the States pass a requete praising the cats for enriching the island’s multicutural diversity whilst criticising dogs for failing to make the cats welcome.
The grasshopper dies of a mephedrone overdose.
The media blame it on the obvious failure of the States to address the root causes of despair arising from his earlier lack of food and shelter and his traumatic experience of prison.
They call for a Minister’s resignation.He agrees to resign at first but then changes his mind claiming that someone has urged him to stay on so that he can make a difference.
The cats are paid a massive compensation because their human rights were infringed when the States failed to advise them on landing that there were mice in Guernsey.
The squirrel,the dog and the Guinea Pig,the victims of the hijacking,the bombing,the burglaries,the robberies,the pickpocketing and the credit card losers are made to pay extra taxes to improve law and order and are warned that they will have to work beyond the age of sixty five because ever increasing spending on social causes is likely to lead to a drastic shortfall in States funds.
AND TODAY’S LESSON IS – GUERNSEY FOR THE GUERNSEY’S
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Ray
Good story, is there a sequal?
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Truth Man, in response:
Perhaps the people who voice an opinion about immigration actually have one, not as a knee jerk reaction, but a view strengthened over time, having observed many instances of needlessly importing people into the island.
Perhaps they are sometimes able to see the essential need to import someone, however, perhaps in this instance, they see yet another fine example of the powers that be failing to organise a replacement within the island and offer a local teacher that chance.
– I don’t know, as I can’t read their minds. Neither can you.
Intelligence has little to do with superiority. Superiority is an attitude. It there’s anyone here that knows that, it’s you…
or have you forgotten you refer to fellow countrymen who don’t share your views as ‘small minded Guerns’, who are apparently so inferior they should be shipped out, presumably so the island can bathe in the light of your ‘broad mindedness’?
Ref the tragic case in Jersey, welllll, T M, it’s an EXAMPLE of what can happen – in this case, DID happen – when immigration is more ‘relaxed’ (as in the UK and Jersey)…rather in the way you talked about, and I quote…
‘I for one would happily see every small minded Guern shipped off this island, and replaced by more capable English, French, American, Latvian, Polish people…’
And finally, I look forward to you giving me some detailed, first hand examples of English people over here being given a harder time from the ‘revolting peasants’ waving their proverbial pitchforks at them than they’d get being the head of St Sampsons.
Right, over to you for more enlightenment….
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Scarlett:
This is not going anywhere. I did not mention superiority, you did. I do not feel superior, you think I think I am. I did not suggest that people who do not share my views should be shipped off the island – I suggested small minded Guerns who cannot see beyond the end of their stubby noses should be shipped off the island. You choose to assume that means I think anyone who does not share my view should be exported.
I happen to like debate, however I do not like small minded people, and those who recognise Mrs Bolt’s nationality as opposed to her skills are being small minded, in my opinion.
The fact remains, I feel uncomfortable with so many people jumping on the import band wagon as soon as they heard the new St Sampson’s High head is from the UK. The people who do so, in my opinion are small minded. I will reserve judgement on her abilities as a head teacher until we hear more. Until then, whether she is born in Guernsey, the UK, or anywhere for that matter is irrelevant. That is me, being broad minded.
And back to your ridiculous story about the ‘import’ in Jersey who committed an offence – I still do not see the point (and I suspect it indicated an underlying stereotypical bias on your part). Should I in response quote to you stories about locals who have committed similar, or worse offences? They would be examples of what happens if we keep locals on the island. Relevant to this argument? No, of course not.
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Scarlett:
It’s just occurred to me… You’re one of them aren’t you?! You actually don’t like the fact that an ‘import’ is going the be the head of St Sampson’s High do you? You can’t see beyond Mrs Bolt’s nationality and concentrate on the fact that she might actually be good for this island can you?! I realise that in all your posts you fall short of saying these things, but the writing is on the wall!
Come on, admit it, you don’t like non-locals invading your island!
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Truth Man.
The Jersey incident happened. Fact. As was the other details I gave.
Whilst you’re sharing your right on views with her parents, don’t forget to mention you think the story of their daughters murder was ridiculous. I’m sure they’ll be up for having an honest debate about open door immigration policies. Really, your attitude is shameful.
And as for superiority *sigh, yawn*….no, were not getting anywhere, TM, as superiority is something you just ARE, not something you SAY you are…good grief, go look it up, man.
So. I’m not going to even try to return to the pertinent view that some here share regarding the authorities lack of effort to fill the position locally, and how I don’t give a monkey’s t*ss where the replacement’s from, all I shall say is that you have converted me, let’s export all the small minded Guerns…
starting with you.
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Scarlett:
I’m not going to backbite – I’m on here to debate and give an opinion (which people don’t have to agree with or like), I’m not on here to bicker.
Take note of this though:
“And as for superiority *sigh, yawn*….no, were not getting anywhere, TM, as superiority is something you just ARE, not something you SAY you are…good grief, go look it up, man.”
It was you who mentioned superiority. I did not say I was, nor do I think I am, and more importantly, nor am I. Your point seems circular, so let’s drop it now – it is not relevant.
In reference to your ridiculous story, surely you can see I was referring to how ridiculous it was that you mention it in this context (and not the fact that the circumstances of the terrible offence were ridiculous)?
I will not continue to discuss the victim’s demise as the case is not relevant to this particular topic and I think it is distasteful to reference it to support your personal views on border control.
If you can return to topic, great, it’d be nice to hear your opinion on the subject rather than seeing you simply commenting on others’ posts. If you don’t want to do that, then I’m afraid I will not be stoking the fire further.
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TM. I am not commenting on ‘others’ posts, I’m responding to yours.
Also, to your refusal to acknowledge that referring to certain fellow islanders as ‘small minded Guerns’ who need deporting is as insulting to them as being called ‘superior’ is to you, apparently.
I think the term is, ‘able to dish it out, but not able to take it’.
As for my opinions on the subject of immigration…one more time with feeling…
1. Having views on limiting immigration does NOT immediately make one some sort of small minded ‘racist’. Referring to your fellow islanders as such, without knowing WHY they feel that way, is also ‘knee jerk’, ‘reactionary’ and equally ‘small minded’.
2. Open door immigration policies, as they have in the UK and in Jersey, has lead to untenable amounts of pressure on already over strained infrastructures that the ‘local’ tax payer has to fund, and that’s the best of the bad news about the effects of unfettered immigration that you can read about on the BBC news website any day of the week…
the one that I and the other ‘small minded Guerns’ (who don’t want to see our island go that way) probably read.
3. In the case of Miss Tetlaw’s replacement, it is possible that someone local with a sound knowledge of the island would have been better placed to take the position. The fact is, we will never know, as the authorities didn’t even try, so bang goes another (rare) local career opportunity for them.
4. The Jersey story is ENTIRELY relevant.
Your argument seems to be that IF further relaxing of the immigration laws means we inadvertently import some criminals (who won’t be turning up with police checks) then that should be OK, as it’s not like we don’t already tolerate some of our own home grown ones, ay….?
…and there, right there, you have me flummoxed, TM, for I simply cannot think of a suitable response to that ridiculous proposal, not in any way, shape or form.
I’m done, TM, the final word is all yours.
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Scarlett:
Actually, you started on this thread commenting on a post from Otto, then from James, and then on to me. Hence my invitation to you to tell us what you actually think about the topic rather than simply referring to other people’s posts and trying to convince us all our opinions are ‘wrong’.
I am in no way insulted by the fact you used the word superior. I am merely correcting you, and telling you I do not feel superior. You read ‘superior’ and were wrong, and now you read ‘insulted’ and are wrong again. Come on, stop trying to tell me how I feel and get back to the topic, please.
On your specific numbered points:
1. I did not use the terms racist or knee jerk and therefore that part of your point 1 is not one I see any point in commenting on, since you seem to be quoting someone else. And to clarify, you are right, having a view on immigration does not make one small minded (and I have never suggested otherwise). My posts make it quite clear that I consider those who cannot see past nationality to be small minded. Again, stick to the topic and stop misrepresenting my comments please.
2. Open door immigration policies do put pressure on local infrastructures. I have NEVER (on this or any forum or in any conversation) advocated an open door policy on immigration. Therefore your point 2 does not relate to anything I have said or suggested so I am unsure why you address it to me. Again, it seems you try to misrepresent me.
3. How do you know there was no attempt to provide a local replacement to Mrs Tetlaw? Is it just possible that the education department knows who it has ‘on the books’ (since they already employ them) and they decided Mrs Bolt’s qualifications are required on the island? We don’t know what their rationale is do we, hence my argument that I will reserve judgement until we see Mrs Bolt in action.
4. The Jersey story is not relevant, as in this thread, I am discussing Mrs Bolt’s appointment to the post at St Sampson’s High and the response by some small minded Guerns who are predisposed to disliking imports. Do you honestly think Mrs Bolt won’t have gone through advance CRB checks? Now, please, remind me again what the relevance of the Jersey story is to the posts I have put on this forum. It seems that you again use it in an unsuccessful attempt to misrepresent me.
And one personal suggestion – before responding to others’ threads, take time to read them. The debate is rather more meaningful if the person you’re debating with doesn’t have to spend their time correcting your mistakes/assumptions.
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*** Scarlett v Truth Man *** ??
Scarlett, too many fallacies of argument introduced, you came across as irrational, so I give it to Truth Man.
Oh, almost forgot … Good luck Mrs B, it sounds like you may need it.
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Truth Man
One does not like to be pedantic but if you think you have superior intelligence to another than surely in relation to intelligence you consider yourself to be superior?
Your offerings are somewhat of a superious nature, you refer to “small minded guerns”!
Did you measure the minds of those you speak of, or were you the one making assumptions?
Maybe you did not notice, long ago as it was, Scarlett had conceded that “Maybe they were right to import this head”.
On one point I do agree with you, I think the Jersey story is not relevant here.
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resoldaB:
I’d never heard the expression fallacies of argument before, but a quick Google has given me some interesting reading – so thanks for that! It’s nice to be able to put a name to those conversations that just seem to jump around out of control!
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Simon:
I’m not going to get drawn into this! I do not consider myself to be a ‘superior being’, but of course I am more intelligent than some people – I am sure you are too (so, are you superior?!)! Using your rationale we are all superior in one way or another – for example a small minded Guern might have more hair than me – in other words a superior head of hair!
My comment small minded Guerns is not an assumption – it is an opinion. As I have constantly stated, I consider those who cannot see past nationality to be small minded!
Your paraphrasing of Scarlett’s comment takes it out of context – so as far as I can see it is not worth acknowledging in the way you suggest I should.
That’s enough on the subject now – I merely gave my opinion. It is inevitable some people will not like my opinion, but that does not change it nonetheless.
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Truth Man
Your opinion it seems is indeed based on an assumption and nothing more!
I think Scarletts comment has sufficient context, and if in any doubt, its readable in full on this page!
Hey look is that the time! were way off subject, enjoy the weekend!
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Simon:
Of course I have not met all of the residents of Guernsey or conducted a survey on the issue – therefore my opinion is based on unscientific personal observation – in the same way many opinions are formed! To call it an assumption is not really accurate – it would be like someone saying they like Guerns because they find them friendly, and then being told that their assertion that Guerns are friendly is an assumption. ‘Assumption’ doesn’t really fit these circumstances. Anyway, don’t take it too seriously – I don’t honestly think we should be putting Guerns on boats out of the island – I was speaking more metaphorically to highlight the point that some ‘imports’ are better for the island than some of our locals are.
And about Scarlett’s comment being out of context – you did take it out of context. Your offer to read the page in full would, of course, put it back in context and in turn would show that you took it out of context in suggesting she gain credit for saying “Maybe they were right to import this head”.
But like you said, it’s hardly the point and we’re just going round in circles!
Likewise – enjoy the weekend – see you at the celebrations!
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Truth Man
Have a good weekend too!
p.s.
I met a few blokes from Jersey the other day, did you know all jersey blokes are brilliant at rugby!
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