Agonising wait for 11-plus results will soon be over
Friday 14th May 2010, 1:00PM BST.
Year 6 pupils begin the 11-plus process in the autumn and finish it in February but have to wait until May for the results.
ABOUT 500 11-year-olds will find out tomorrow where they will be going to school from September.
Of the 606 pupils in Year 6 across Guernsey, 82% sat the 11-plus.
Roughly a quarter [125] of those will proceed to the Grammar School or colleges while the remainder will move on to the high schools in their catchment area.
Pupils sat the last of the tests in February and Education minister Carol Steere said the announcement of results took place when it did for sound reasons.
‘It’s not about the length of time that it takes to process results, but about keeping the year group together,’ she said. ‘It’s a stressful and anxious time for children and it can split groups within a classroom.’
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Does it really matter? A-Level and GCSEs take roughly the same amount of time and it is arguably more important than 11+ results!
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I failed the 11+ and I am now completing my second masters degree, I run an international business. It was a useless exam, and only ends up hurting people that need not be hurt. Abolish it as soon as possible, even comprehensive would be better. The system where I now live is soooo much better. I would never let my kids take a public IQ/verbal reasoning exam.
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Peter, I agree that ‘failing’ an 11+ can be hurtful, however we do identity the children who struggle in order to give them appropriate education, why can we not do this for the brighter kids?
Yes the exam may have been useless for you, but certainly not for everyone.
One thing I would say though is that I have witnessed a rise in parent pressure surroundign the 11+. I think this is unnecessary for children of that age, and as Peter will testify you don’t need to pass to become successful.
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By all means Dean, each child should be provided with appropriate education, but to be honest until the educational tier system is abolished then the 11+ is one way of screening. I think I have a philospohical/political issue with a hierarchy of educational streams. This is said having had the been provided with a private education, which allowed me to go onto etc etc. I often wonder what would happen if every child got that route. Not to say that the teachers and schools provided by the state are poor, but it is the cultural expectations that are associated with them that need to be changed and I just dont think that will happen when the island community supports the status quo by continuing with the screening of the 11+. I knew that the fact that have done well despite having “failed” the 11+ could be presented as evidence that it works, but as I say I was in a position where my parents chose to take me privately into the top stream . So I “succeeded” by having the education that the state did not think it worth paying for me for, this is my whole point, how much other talent goes undiscovered????
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I think I might support the 11 Plus more if it were truly a test of ability and potential.
Sadly I think it has become more a test of parental ambition and finances.
Better off, more ambitious parents pay for their children to have specialized tuition to improve their chances of passing.
It would be a reasonably fair test if it were not for this. But when some children get practice and tuition while others do not, it becomes much less fair.
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I was educated in Guernsey and took the 11+ which I ‘failed’ and then went to St Sampsons. Funnily enough, at that tender age, I never saw it as a pass or fail, I just was relieved that my friends who I was close to were coming with me to the same secondary school. Interestingly, I excelled quite well in my education; I went to university and came away with a good degree, I’ve since have had very good jobs and am now working for an internationally known brand in Denmark.
Now take my husband, who was educated in Denmark through a non-tiered education. The way the education system is set up here is very much that everyone is treated the same in the same classes. The result, is that whilst my husband is exceptionally clever, he never was challenged and found school ‘too easy’, therefore he got lazy and didn’t study because he didn’t need to. However this was to his detriment when at university, as this habit meant that he had no experience of studying which put him at a disadvantage to his fellow students and therefore he possibly didn’t do as well as he could have done. (he freely admits this)
I think there are pro’s and con’s to both systems, but the current 11+ at least enables teachers to assess at what level a childs capabilities are, and therefore what school would be most appropriate to them. And whilst parents may pay for a child to go to private school, that is no guarantee in how they will perform later in life….so likewise can be said for those who ‘fail’ and go to one of the state schools.
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I agree that the 11 plus system is flawed, but there is always going to be some sort of streaming system and until someone can come up with a better solution we are stuck with it.
The main problem with the current 11 plus system is that many parents are spending a fortune on private tuition to give their child an edge – which of course entirely defeats the object of the ‘ability selection’ process.
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James – Many parents “fail” the 11+ by coaching and mentoring. This may ensure that their children either i) end up at the wrong school by overperforming in the exam; ii) get totally disillusioned by not fulfilling their parents’ hopes and expectations. It may also mean that some other kids are prevented from going to the “right” school, because some of those places are taken by the “wrong” kids.
I’m not anti 11+, but I think it is becoming devalued by this fiddling round the edges. Seems to me (correct me if this is nonsense) that most teachers’ kids “pass” (i.e. get the school of their choice, if you like) – which is rather odd if it’s truly based on ability and potential.
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Interesting comments. Of course, just because most of the year 6 kids in England don’t take the 11+ doesn’t mean they don’t have a tiered system.
Those whose parents can afford private education do so.
Those who want to tutor their kids prep them to take the 11+ for the few remaining highly competitive selective state schools.
Those who can afford to move to be in a better catchment area do so. Those who want to convert to Catholicism to get into the good state Catholic school in the area do so.
Those who are nearest the best/newest most over subscribed high schools get in while those who miss out by a matter of inches (while their neighbours get in because they are ‘nearer as the crow flies’) are sent across town to the failing secondary schools which still have hundreds of spaces because nobody wants their kids to go there.
Until all schools offer the same standard of education, there will never be a fair system, neither in England, nor in Guernsey. At least Guernsey recognises that different styles of education suit different kids. It’s not perfect, but I would argue it’s better than England.
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Why do the Colleges and Grammar schools have a ‘smart’ uniform i.e. white shirt, tie, blazer …… while the other high schools have a scruffy sweatshirt and polo shirt?
Does casual wear = casual education while smart wear = smart education?
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I agree that the current system is flawed and that this flaw is made worse by the “free places” given for the various colleges as part of the 11 plus. If you take fees of c£7k pa over a 6/7 year school life (assuming A levels taken) Then it would certainly be worthwhile to spend a couple of grand on tuition for that saving. Therefore you can understand why ambitious parent who maybe cannot ( or maybe can )afford college fees may go down this route. This is obviously unfair for those kids who are not prepped but it is inevitable in this Island were status means so much and cash is King ! You can only hope that the truly bright kids will shine in whatever school they end up in !
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Well my daughter passed to go to Ladies’ College. My preparation was buying a couple of 11+ papers and then being told that I had the wrong ones, and of those she only did a few from one book and got bored! So it’s all her own work. Couldn’t afford to spend lots on tuition anyway, and then if your child gets through to a school which is too fast paced for them it’s only the child who is going to suffer.
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If Beaucamps was done up it would take a lot of the pressure off. I am finding that a lot of kids (and parents) who are in the St Sampsons catchment want to go to the new school in preference to both Grammar and the private schools. Due to this they dont really feel any pressure to take the 11+ anymore (or to have tutoring if they do) and Im wondering if this will show through on this years results for that part of the island. If Beaucamps was done up then the pressure would be off island-wide.
Ive said this in previous posts and i still believe that 3 schools with different specialisms to cater for differing talents would be the ideal solution.
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Although it does have an effect, I don’t think in Guernsey that a child’s performance in the 11+ determines their future chances of success. Like some of the people here, I know of people who ‘failed’ the 11+ and have become extremely successful in their chosen careers, while others who ‘passed’ have ended up nowhere.
Some kids take longer to develop, or there are other factors involved. Still, in my opinion, those with a good mix of ability, common sense, ambition and determination will eventually achieve some degree of success.
I think it’s perfectly reasonable to tier education based on academic ability. What is important though is that places are determined by ability alone, not the size of the parental wallet. I also think more investment in vocational education is necessary, as some people are not academically gifted but are excellent at more practical skills.
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I see criticism of parents who “prep” their children for the 11+. These comments often seem to be in general terms, sometimes referring to “people with bigger wallets” with a sense of jealousy. This is OK for those dealing in the abstract of the selection process but it’s perfectly natural and in my view correct for any parent to support their own child to maximise his or her potential. Until you find a better system for selection, don’t blame parents who want the best for their siblings.
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Greenmonster
The point is that if a child can only “pass” the 11+ by being given extra tuition then the results are distorted and the child is likely to struggle further down the line due to the pace of work etc, unless the parents are going to continue to pay for extra tuition throughout the child’s education. My belief is that in many cases it is actually about what the parents want, in terms of their own perceived social status, rather than what may actually be best for the child in the longterm.
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Green Monster This is unbelievable not only are parents prepping their children, they are also prepping their siblings as well ?
I know there ar a few strange families in Guernsey but surely not………….
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I believe that my son has passed to the right school for his abilities, namely La Mare de Carteret. He will hopefully thrive in an environment which will allow him to find his own way without the added pressures that appear to follow those Grammar School children. He has Aspergers, and whilst extremely intelligent found the non verbal reasoning papers etc completely purposeless!
One has to understand that private education over here is far more affordable than that in the UK for example. Thank goodness for that – as it makes it more possible, given some severe tightening of one’s belts to buy your way into that sort of school if you want it. It dosen’t suit everyone of course, but that is your choice.
I am thankful that my son will be going to a decent school, as opposed to the one he should have been attending in the UK, where it is more a case of crowd control than teaching.
The 11 plus will always be argued over – but as an 11 plus “failure”, I haven’t done too badly – and it is the teaching staff at whatever school which will make the most difference to our children – not the fabric of the school.
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Sarnia Expat, I think your son’s greatest asset is you, a level-headed, sensible and clear-thinking parent who is able to see what your child needs and to appreciate the merits of each of the island’s different schools. Like you, I hope that your son thrives at La Mare.
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I think many of you are reading far too much into this exam. Remember, 11 plus selection for the majority of students, last for five short years between finishing Primary School and starting at the Sixth Form College. Why do we feel the need to divide up students for this short period of time?
The exam papers are sixty years old. It must be the oldest exam in the world!!
The reason for selection on this island has nothing to do with education, it is money.
We need the 11 plus to identify ‘Special Place Holder’ for the Colleges. If we found a better way (fairer way?) to fund the Colleges, then ‘hey presto’ the 11 plus exam would go. It really is as simple as that, but so many people don’t realise it.
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The sooner the 11+ goes the better. This ‘pass/fail’ tag is a nonsense. It’s a selection process but some people still insist on referring to it as either passing to Grammer / College or failing it and going to a Secondary school.
It’s far too much pressure on young shoulders if you ask me. The Monday after you receive your results the little groups gather in the playground and you start to feel pigeon holed because your not going to either Grammer or College. The pressure from ‘Pushy’ parents is bad enough for a child.
Surely the form teachers can tell where a child is best suited for the next step in the Education ladder.
The best thing taught to me in my education was a ‘Link Course’ that was done on a day release scheme from Les Beaucamps to the CFE.
That course taught me everything i needed to know about my decisions on what i was going to do with my life after leaving school. The skills i was introduced to still help me to this day.
If there is any child out fretting over going to an ordinary Secondary school, then don’t. You’ve will have as many opportunities as anyone else if not more. The only other thing i can say don’t let your school time pass you by, you will only regret it in later life.
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