1

Ray

Go for the two year system

It might be a pain to organise and it may put some people off voting but the sheer pleasure of at least having an opportunity every couple of years to get shot of some of the useless chancers from other Parishes who scrape in and mess things up could eventually add thousands to the island wide polling booths.

( Vale deputies included)

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3

Rees Bryant

How will this work for Alderney? Or will Alderney still be treated as a Parish?

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5

Martino

Island wide voting is a nice idea but totally and utterly impractical and unworkable.
Even with a reduction to 30 deputies an island wide election would be a freak show, a circus, a lottery (just imagine a hustings night with a hundred candidates outnumbering the audience) and it would produce a States even worse than the one we have now.
This is the simple fact of the matter and I have yet to hear anything resembling an argument to say that this nightmare could be avoided under any sort of IWV system.

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7

valeite

I for one would not like to have to read anymore manifestos than I have to.And 2 years is definately not long enough for newcomers, there is a lot to learn.I want to stick with the current system as I think over the years the Vale parish has had a very good mixture of Deputies and have served the parish well.

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9

Paul Le Page

Martino, yet again I have to agree with you which is a pity as I am a supporter of IWV in principle.

The unfortunate truth though is that like you I have yet to see a workable method of implementation. Some of the methods proposed won’t give any improvements and, as you say, could well make things worse.

It seems to me that the only way IWV could work would be to limit the number of candidates – of course this compromises democracy. Another way would be to change to a party political system. Of course that has its own drawbacks and, although I broadly favour that idea, I can also see where people like Dave Jones come from when they oppose it.

Unfortunately I have to conclude that until a practical and sensible solution is found that is of tangible benefit to the island, we should stick with what we’ve got. It ain’t perfect but there’s no point replacing one lemon with another.

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11

Dave Jones

Paul Le P

Paul
It is my belief that Island wide voting would go some way to making everyone of us as elected representatives, accountable to ALL of the electorate, at least through the ballot box. Many of the opponents of island wide voting have regularly dismissed the idea as being too complicated or too difficult to administer, or another view is that the public would find the process too complex to understand, in terms of numbers and choice of candidates. I can only say that if that is the strength of the opposition’s argument, against I.W.V then it is intellectually bankrupt by its content, not to mention hugely insulting to the intelligence of the electorate as a whole, who consistently show that they are much brighter than any of us ever give them credit for. One problem we have, is that our people do not believe anymore that they can influence the States of Deliberation, they certainly don’t believe it at election time because they can only vote for a handful of people, which is why I believe they are turning their backs on the whole electoral process. They simply don’t feel that they have any say or influence over the majority of politicians that are elected to govern them. As for the question of choice, the voter has very little real choice of candidates on polling day, those who do bother to turn out to vote, (if exit interviews are to be believed) usually end up voting for the candidates they either dislike least, the comment often used is “the best of a bad bunch”, rather than selecting those across the island that they believe will best represent their views in their parliament. Finding themselves in this situation the only other option open to those disaffected voters, unable to find a suitable candidate in their voting area, is to spoil their paper, or not to vote at all. An option it would seem, more and more people are adopting. For the hundreds of islanders who believe that States Members have turned their backs on them altogether. They in turn decide that they no longer wish to be involved in the electoral process. People need to feel that their vote matters, when they see that it doesn’t, they find other things to do on polling Day.
Paul I passionately believe it could work but we would need to change the way we do things at the moment. For example, currently there is a media black out for candidates in the run up to the election at the very time when the public crave to know who is standing and what they stand for. This at a time when the media should be engaging with those who want to stand and helping those candidates get their electoral message across. I also believe that new candidates should be given more media help and Air time (TV, Radio, etc) than returning candidates, as we have had four years to get our message across to the voting public and I would suspect most voters would know where we stand on lots of issues. The act of putting a cross on a piece of paper goes back to medieval times. We simply have to bring our electoral system into the modern age. I believe we would need a 3 or 4 page pull out from the Guernsey Press with all the candidates manifestoes clearly laid out in those pages new candidates should be allowed 3-4 hundred more words than existing candidates as they are starting from scratch. The public would need to have this publication a full month before polling day, in order that they can study closely the candidates, this publication would be sent at States expense to every household on the electoral roll. Secondly we would as candidates set up our stall in the sports hall of Beau Sejour or some other large venue and the public could come to us and tackle us one to one on any subject or policy they choose after all they turn out to the hustings now in fairly large numbers just to hear the same question being answered in a different way by a dozen or so candidates, which I suggest doesn’t really give you much idea of what you are likely to get when you vote. This going to see the candidates would not be unusual for our people, we ran this system in the Vale very successfully alongside a parish husting meeting at the last election and a fair number of people turned up at these sessions and were grateful for the one to one interviews, sometimes people want to look into your eyes when they ask you something or see your body language when you are put on the spot. Or if they prefer they could ring the candidate and ask specific questions on the issues that concerned them. I think people are more interested in who governs them than they have ever been and will take the trouble to go over the candidates manifestoes thoroughly and ask the questions they want the answers too. I ask all those who think the present system is working, whether you think the present crop of States members are the ones the island would have chosen in an island wide vote, I am not sure we are. I am making no judgement on the present States of course but it is a fair question and one I am asked frequently when the subject of IWV crops up.
Modern elections throughout the world are carried out using electronic voting, postal votes, and touch screen computers why not voting by text? Any modern democracy, even one as small as ours, can have whatever type of election we desire. There are highly respected organisations across the western world that could provide all the necessary equipment and hardware to run a ‘modern’ election in this island, all we have to do is have the political will to do it. Touch screen TV’s at the polling booths one for each district with the voter choosing who they want to represent them by going down the line the other advantage is that these votes would be counted electronically so you would not be waiting until two in the morning to get the results. Look, there may be some hiccups when we first try it but I believe in time islanders will wonder why we didn’t do it years ago, deputies who get elected, will for the first time in their lives have to worry about what ALL islanders think of their policies, not just a small number in their electoral district who are the only ones under the present system who can remove them from office, that reason alone is enough for me to support IWV.

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13

Maz

I think the way the States works should be brought into the 21 century.

These types of government systems were originally put in place because the communication systems were relatively poor, historically if you wanted to get information to the masses you really only had word of mouth, then as time went by we got newspapers, then radio, and then tv. You could not ask the masses what they wanted as it would have taken too long to see everyone, so you picked a representative from your parish to answer for you.
Now that we have mobile phones and the internet we can all make the decisions if asked. In other words I think we should have a small core of Deputies in the States (I am not sure how many this should be, but certainly less than we have now), but any real decisions should be voted on by the people of Guernsey, either by text or on-line voting (there would be public computers for those without access to one).
For example, when the Incinerator first came on the agenda, the core states members could have requested all the information about it, then published that, then asked for the people’s view (who would provide alternative information if they had it) then we could all have voted.
That to me would be true democracy, the view of the majority not the minority we get now.

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15

Paul Le Page

Dave Jones – thank you for your comprehensive reply.

In my view it simply boils down to one thing: will the Guernsey public take the time to carefully study what could be up to 100 manifestos? One point you mention is that many people have lost faith in politics and given up. I honestly do not believe that asking disillusioned people to spend hours studying dozens of manifestos is the way to encourage them to get involved again.

I don’t think it’s insulting to the intellect of the Guernsey public to suggest studying that number of candidates in detail would be a daunting prospect.
Although some might dispute it, I don’t consider myself intellectually bankrupt; I’m well educated and have done OK in life. I must confess though I think I would struggle, not least because I am the father of a young child and have commitments – I simply just don’t know where I’d find the time to study them all in detail, and I’m someone who enjoys the cut and thrust of politics!

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17

Arnald

I think IWV is essential. The issues facing Guernsey are no longer parochial.

That said, some are; so we must incorporate that also.

There is no reason not to have parish-based elections – as they are now.

So we vote as before.

But then we take take the three most popular from the parish votes to make their case why they would want to head departments.

That would require a manifesto that directed their energies to what they believed in, how they could make a difference.

That’s where IWV would be the most useful.
Even then we could then have IWV on the results of the winners of that vote.

We may end up with an executive government, but at the end, it would be a democratic process. Within that, those that were highly elected butnot votedin, would act as an active channel for opposition.

We must get the public involved. Otherwise we get debacles such as Suez. If it were passed by asystem that had been voted in, then acceptance is democratic.

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19

Sean McManus

I posit the following as a notion to prompt debate ahead of the June debate on IWV.

The call for IWV seems to originate from two main sources :-

1. Those who strongly advocate the principle that all those on the electoral roll should be able to elect their representatives for the whole States.

2. Those with real concerns about the quality and calibre of those politicians occupying the “top” posts, especially the CM and the DCM.

It is possible to secure a compromise whereby those seeking the most senior posts should enjoy IW support. This could be put into effect including a nomination process which required the endorsement of at least 5 (or more) serving Deputies and/or at least 12 (or more) signatures from those already inscribed upon the electoral roll. One might add that at least 3 electoral districts should be so represented in order to eliminate frivolous nominations.

With the bulk o Deputies retaining their parish/electoral district links but the top posts requiring confirmation of IW support, the Island might feel those in the States enjoy a greater measure of legitimacy than currently.

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