Top hotel or apartments favoured for brewery site
Saturday 28th August 2010, 2:30PM BST.
Robert Egleton’s property overlooks the former brewery at Havelet and he would not like its look to change too much. (Picture by Adrian Miller, 1016851)
A HIGH-CLASS seafront hotel or open market apartments are two of the options for the old brewery site at Havelet being backed by its neighbours.
On Thursday, the Environment Department released a development brief asking islanders what they would like to see done with the property, located on prime town-centre land described by some as ‘the island’s front door’.
Properties in the Strand back onto the site, once home to the Guernsey Brewery. There are also many houses around Havelet, the steep road bordering it.
The building, at the foot of Le Val des Terres, has stood empty for about a decade. Residents want something to be done soon with the neglected building and would welcome development.
- Read the full story in the Guernsey Press. See below for subscription details.
- To read Guernsey Press stories in full click here for subscription details. Individual editions are now available online.
Campaigns
Voice For Victims
Voice for Victims is a campaign aimed at promoting the rights of those affected by child sexual abuse.
This is Guernsey
Guernsey Press
Hotel please, we don’t need more open market housing.
Report abuse
Agree GG
What
a spectacular hotel that could be too
Report abuse
I thought tourism was struggling so why bother with a hotel? Residential apartments? or maybe self catering?
Report abuse
We might not need more open market housing but do we really need more hotel, every corner you seem to turn at the moment there is a hotel. put a few bars in it a couple restaurants and maybe a new cinema, or even better some affordable local market housing.
Report abuse
Why don’t we need Open Market houses? I don’t think there have been any additional ones since the 1970′s, have there? Every additional one brings money and employment to the island so what would be the problem, other than jealousy of course. As for ‘affordable housing’ – why would you expect prime front line property to be earmarked for cheap homes or States housing?
Report abuse
I think it’s a done deal anyhow?
Braemar holdings (subsidiary of Comprop) owns houses up the strand and up havelet, yet the GP hasn’t made any mention of this? Why would Tom Scott buy up these places if it weren’t for the intention of providing accommodation for the future staff at whatever he has planned for the brewery?
Rather predictably they aren’t mentioned on the brief.
Report abuse
GG – that must have been a tricky one for you? open market is bound to be made up of foreign types? whereas hotels is only temporary foreign types (with the guests more temporary than the staff?), unless the owner, like your high street shop owners, are also foreign? your tick box list for all things political i expect has foreigner mentioned beside every box? how simple your world has become.
Report abuse
Amazing that anyone would even dare suggest a hotel. That just shows how out of touch people are with their island.
O M housing is all you can put there. Islanders are always bleating poverty and yet try to hold onto draconian housing laws that are killing the island.
There are so many positives for living and investing in Guernsey and it is thwarted by the flawed belief that opening up the island from an immigration perspective would be a bad thing.
Get rid of open and local housing regulations and the island will find a more self sustaining balance.
Report abuse
I disagree with doing away with the Open Market, it is a sensible way of protecting house prices from going through the roof and controlling the number of non locals who have the right to live here. Without it we would only need some other form of immigration control. If somebody wants to pay £3M+ for a flat in the Old Brewery why shouldn’t they, they are going to pay tax and help our economy?
I don’t see any reason not to review the number and quality of OM properties, I believe I am right in saying that there have always been around 1800 since the 1970′s. At the same time the overall number of houses has probably doubled so in effect the percentage may have halved. From what I have seen of OM houses, most were built in the 60′s and many are in a horrible state – well off locals would not want to live in them anyway.
Report abuse
Bean Jar,nothing to do with jealousy,Pease get your facts right. Open market houses and Apartments have been constantly developed since 1970 despite laws to the contrary, and not every open market resident provides additional employment to Islanders unless you are referring to jobs like cleaning and ironing in which case they are well catered for by our friends from portugal.
Report abuse
AJ, I’m pretty sure you are wrong. What I said was “I don’t think there have been any additional ones since the 1970’s”. A few OM houses have been replaced by new ones over the years but I don’t believe the overall number has ever increased.
As far as OM residents not providing additional employment apart from cleaners, of course that is nonsense. Are you telling me these people don’t need accountants, advocates, bankers, estate agents, doctors, dentists, shops, States workers of every kind (apart from social services, maybe) etc. etc. More importantly, they pay 20% tax on their not inconsiderable worldwide earnings. In fact pretty much like you and me, only more so!
If your point is that the people providing services like cleaning and ironing tend to be foreign that is Guernsey’s own silly fault for dishing out so many licenses when we have 4-500 skivers sitting around on the dole.
Report abuse
A.J. I think you will find if you do your research that every time a new open market flat or house is built / developed, than another one has to be removed from the register. The open market has not therefore expanded since the register was closed forty years ago. The number remains constant – and it’s right that as a proportion of housing it has decreased due to the amount of new local market housing. Keep open market, it’s the one of the precious things that keeps some level of fairness for the locals and also for those living in open market some protection from being accused of crowding out the Guernseyman. Get rid of open and the incomers would never hear the end of it. It would also prevent some businesses from expanding as open market is their last resort for staff when they can’t get qualified people locally.
Report abuse
The Royal Yacht Hotel in Jersey should be used as an example of how a nice hotel, complete with nice restaurants, bars & Spa within it can be a draw for tourists and used by locals. It also has to look far better then it does now.
Also, our sea front is already littered with apartments, and there will soon be more, once the development at La Salerie is completed.
Report abuse
A.J.
Whilst O/Ms have indeed been developed since the 1970′s it is a case of one having to be taken off the register before it can be replaced by a newbuild. So the number of O/M’s has remained constant since the register was closed
Report abuse
There is an opportunity to loo at this development alongside the marinisation of Number 1 beach (Havelet) and the slaughter house. It would be a missed opportunity to consider this development in isolation.
Report abuse
Dave “Get rid of open and local housing regulations and the island will find a more self sustaining balance.”
Or just an island overrun and dictated by foreigners, look at the UK for instance.
A hotel with a decent restaurant which can be enjoyed by all is the only option imo, why should O/M housing be a priority?
It’s a great location, I love the views from the welly boot.
Report abuse
beanjar –
you said – “if your point is that the people providing services like cleaning and ironing tend to be foreign that is Guernsey’s own silly fault for dishing out so many licenses when we have 4-500 skivers sitting around on the dole”.
i agree with too many licences but not with your offensive throw-away judgement that every claimant to unemployment benefit is a skiver. what nonsense. unemployment levels mushroomed all over the world in the last couple of years – did one of history’s most damaging ecomomic downturns pass you by, or do you just swallow the daily mail like brushing your teeth? such remarks cast big doubts on the rest of your arguements.
neil inder -
you said – “There is an opportunity to loo at this development alongside the marinisation of Number 1 beach (Havelet) and the slaughter house. It would be a missed opportunity to consider this development in isolation”.
so after north beach and after salerie fill-ins, havelet?! do you not see the value of the bay as it is? and after havelet, then belle greve, bordeaux, l’ancresse, and on down the west coast until our coastal landscape is just one triangle of straight lines? guernsey’s fundamental character is that of an island full of wonderful geography and landscape – level it off with more marinas and we are as alive and attractive as a bucketload of dead eyed fish on the shiny steel deck of ‘mv ‘thepricetofeverythingthevalueofnothing’ .
Report abuse
GG –
you said – “…Or just an island overrun and dictated by foreigners, look at the UK for instance…”
please indulge me with your examples of how the UK is both overrun and dictated by foreigners? you are so insular and xenophobic, you seem to beg the chance to interbreed to extinction? actually, come to think of it GG …
Report abuse
blah, I’ll retract the ’4-500 skivers’ when you tell me why these people are incapable of any of the thousands of jobs that we issue licenses for. Everything from shop work to vegetable picking, window cleaning to bar work, building to gardening. And that’s assuming that they are unqualified for anything better. The recession is not a factor when there are thousands of people here on license. Don’t include those ‘medically incapable’, I was talking purely about the unemployed.
Report abuse
Beanjar
A very good post – I would also question some of those who are deemed to be “medically incapable”. I know of two people who are on long term sickness benefit (about £300 per week once rent is included) and there is absolutely nothing wrong with them, apart from the fact that they’d rather spend all day in the pub rather than at work. I’m sure there are plenty of other spurious claims, add them all up and we’re talking about quite a considerable sum.
Report abuse
blah
Identifying or bringing into a conversation an under utilised area corner of St Peter Port which can generate revenue doesn’t mean I’d like to see Fermain filled in.
Relax
Report abuse
Beanjar
Its very simpl;e really. In times of full employment, which for Guernsey fortunately has been most of the past 15-20 years, locals have not wanted nor needed to work in hotels, restaurants, pick flowers etc because there have been other jobs available which involve more sociable hours and are basically more appealing. Only when unemployment levels rise do locals start to consider doing such work, but employers in those industries are not keen to take on only those who see their jobs as a “last resort”. Immigrant workers are happy and willing to do these jobs all the time, and so a business can operate with constant labour available, rather than having to replace locals who will jump ship as soon as a “better” job comes along.
Businesses like hotels, restaurants and growers also tend to have accommodation available for their immigrant workers, which the employer would be left to pay for if he employed locals who wouldn’t need accommodation. As the accommodation forms part of the immigrant worker’s wage arrangement, the local employer would be asked to pay higher wages to the local in lieu of employment, so the employer would be paying twice. The whole thing then becomes non-viable for the employer.
If employers knew that reliable locals would be available permanently to do the work then they could happily let go of their worker accommodation. But if locals only come into that labour pool once in a blue moon when unemployment levels rise above say 400, then you can surely understand that they cannot run a business on that basis.
The unemployment level in Guernsey has hovered around 200 for several years now, even in times of full employment, which suggests that most of those 200 people are probably “hard-core unemployable” for whatever reason.
Report abuse
Some of you older people may recall that the original plans for the Royal Hotel and Savoy sites along the Glategny Esplanade were intended to have exactly the same use as the proposed Brewery site ie hotels and other tourist related usages with a small part allocated to housing(local and open market).
On this basis I would expect therefore to see several new office blocks and over priced luxery apartments on the Brewery site in less than 10 years time and the same old arguments about Guernsey losing another part of its heritage and skyline to modern architecture!
Report abuse
Getting back to the Brewery Site,oh yes,a prime site for a top class hotel and restaurant.And after a nice tasty lunch how about dodging the doggy bits on the once beautiful Havelet Bay for a swim?.Or enjoying,while looking over the wall to the Bay,the lovely sea breezes wafting over you,and with a bit of luck added to by the wind being in the right direction the scent of yesterdays dinner being brought back to you!But the brewery smelt delicious!!!!I’m just naturally romantic!
Report abuse
I’m not too bothered what they do with it as long as they do something soon. The place is falling to wrack and ruin and does the island no favours in its current state.
Report abuse
At the risk of sounding too defeted, the decision has already been made by our Dictators. The kind act of allowing the Islanders the chance to exercise their view is a cruel ploy to keep the locals at bay whilst providing themselves with some much needed humour.
Money talks louder than we can. Rest assured, it will benefit the few rather than the majority.
Report abuse
Blah, I think what GG was referring to was the situation in some of the Shires where some villages are empty during the winter months because locals have been forced out by second home owners. village life has been completely destroyed, pubs shops and small businesses have had to close through lack of year round trade.
I’m not saying that would happen in Guernsey as Guernsey is not village size, but I how many O/M owners actually stay here for a long a enough period in the year to pay tax. Many of them have houses here there and everywhere spending thier time following the sun and avoiding tax, including Guernsey tax.
Lets Forget the few hundred skivers for a moment and think about the hundreds of hard working couples and individuals who can’t and never will be able get on the property ladder. What we need is less greed and more affordable housing for our youngsters trying to make a start in life. What we don’t need is more of our valuable land and resources taken up by O/M property.
As for the Brewery site, how about a brewery.
Report abuse
I always thought that site would make a stunning entertainment centre, with the likes of a cinema, pool hall, arcade and even perhaps a couple of bars.
The building itself is enormous throughout and town would benefit greatly from something along those lines. It would also open up peoples eyes in terms of the area of ‘Town’, it’s much more then just the highstreet!
Report abuse
Looks like it’s going to be over priced open market housing, wonderful.
Report abuse
either as a entertainment centre as matt suggested, or how about multi storey car park?
Report abuse
Stance,
We must have on the same waveline as the thought came to me last night.What an excellent site for a multiple car park,to blend in with the surrounds,below the skyline,and the parkers would not have to crawl through the Town to get to their parking!Ideal I’d say for long stay parkers.
Report abuse
Whatever gets built on the site lets just hope its in keeping with the Credit Suisse building & not some greenhouse/glass box in order to maximise the spectacular views
Report abuse
As an ex pat living in Australia I visited Guernsey again two years ago and agree with you all that the brewery site is an eyesore, however, since I am no longer a local, I will not put my two bobs worth in regarding what should be done with the site but I will comment on your letters.
I get enormous pleasure reading all of your various arguments and marvel at you typical Guerns tearing each others comments apart whilst in typical Guernsey fashion, not tearing each other apart. Cor damme me, your a bunch of bloney good fellas eh. Keep up the good work.
Report abuse
I really DID want to join in the positive, feel good ‘hoorah, they’re developing that site into something wonderful’ vibe, right up to the point where I saw the Press photo of the two gentlemen invited in to consult on the design, at which point, my joy somewhat cooled…….
glass box, anyone…?
Report abuse
Scarlett, you’re forgetting two other important ingredients, concrete and steel…
Report abuse