Fisherman left high and dry in court
Monday 21st February 2011, 1:00PM GMT.
Neil Corbet with the fishing boat which, along with his licence and gear, has been repossessed after he failed to pay his loans. (Picture by Adrian Miller, 1095628)
A Royal Court order to sell off a fisherman’s equipment to pay back a bank debt has left him without a livelihood, he said.
Neil Corbet’s fishing boat and licence have also been repossessed by finance company Cherry Godfrey, arrested by HM Sheriff, and will also be sold off.
‘I just feel that part of my life has been removed because fishing is my passion, my life and my livelihood,’ said Mr Corbet of 125, Les Genats Estate, Route de Carteret, Cobo.
HSBC Bank was awarded judgement for £10,000 with interest and costs against Mr Corbet in February last year. In November, HM Sheriff’s office seized Mr Corbet’s boat, Boy William, but it was found that the title for the vessel belonged to loans company Cherry Godfrey. Mr Corbet’s sister had been guarantor for the debt for the boat and the fishing licence and had both passed to Cherry Godfrey. HM Sheriff’s staff then seized Mr Corbet’s fishing equipment.
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I have every sympathy with Mt Corbet and I am sure that Cherry Godfrey do not want to own a fishing boat and licence.
What avenues did Cherry Godfrey try before reporssessing the boat and licence?
Why did Mr Corbet use these as collateral for the loan? If he used them as collateral for the loan heshould have realised that if he did not keep up his repayments then they might be repossessed by the finance company.
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The fact of the matter was that he obviously wasn’t fishing efficiently enough or often enough to pay the bills. He could have taken on other work when the weather was bad or the tides weren’t suitable. He could have worked in a bar in the evenings. Fishing’s no different to any other job – if the work’s not there do something else, no-one has a god-given right to fish.
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It’s always difficult to comment on these articles as nobody knows the full story.
When I read it though, the following came immediately to mind:
In ancient Israel there was a regulation that prevented creditors from taking working equipment as security for debt, as effectively they were taking their livelihood as repayment.
This regulation was noted in the Bible: “Do not take a pair of millstones – not even the upper one – as security for a debt, because that would be taking a man’s livelihood as security.” [Deuteronomy 24:6]
I know a lot of people aren’t religious who read these pages but you don’t need to believe in God to see the wisdom in this. By taking another man’s livelihood you are taking away their ability to repay – and often their dignity to boot.
I hope a solution is found that will enable Mr Corbet to continue fishing and repay his debts.
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Although not religious myself Paul has a good point
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Paul le Page, Thank you and it is actually nice to see some people are open minded, in fact there is another side to the story and people cant help attacking something when they dont know the entire facts of the matter which i am not going to discuss on here, also Lyn i didnt not put the boat up as collateral, it was on a HP agreement which i didnt have a say in, also yes i was in a slight arrears to cherry godfrey which was an easily affordable payment considering, but it was like i wasnt paying them, infact i had paid 75% of the loans to cherry godfrey back and the loans would have been complete by July 2012 and i was paying them more than most people’s mortgage ( £1100 a month ) by myself to reduce any arrears that had accrued because of problematic circumstances, also considering the expenses of the vessel to, so is it any wonder that i did infact have a few financial problems come the end, money only stretches so far, and i was just starting to get myself out of when this all happened, i dont need to explain myself but just merely shedding some light on this situation.
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No matter what no one should take the tools of a mans trade away. It just goes to show how low a financial institution will go.
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Neil – good to hear your viewpoint and good luck for the future.
PLP – interesting point.
However, as Neil states, the boat was on HP (Hire Purchase). This means that HP provider actually owns (in law) what is being purchased as part of the HP agreement (until the final payment is made). So if you don’t pay up its tough.
HP is the worst type of credit if you get into trouble (apart from a payday loan!).
HP often seems the best route but an unsecured loan is better even if the rates are higher.
So your biblical analogy is most interesting but of no relevence for Neil’s circumstances. Sadly!
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Neil
I would challenge this decision if I was you , despite the fact you were in arrears , if , as you say , you were making payments they had no right to repossess, if you had stopped making payments then thats a different matter.
Push the matter, and most importantly go to a third party who will not charge you for their advice, DONT go to a company that charges a monthly fee but use a charity based organisation such as CCCS http://www.cccs.co.uk/ and that goes for anyone who has debts that are problematic
You should never have let it go to court but there is still options ( I know , I am in the same situation )
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You didn’t have a say in your HP agreement? Err, yes you did, you agreed to take it out in the first place.
We can all rest assured that Cherry Godfrey and anyone else involved would rather have had the money you owe out of you and not have to go through all this court palaver and then end up with having to flog a bloney boat. But they cleared decided they weren’t going to get their money so have taken the only route available to them.
Thats what happens when you take out a loan or any such agreement and can’t pay it back.
But well done to you for coming on trying to defend yourself (please put in some paragraphs next time, makes it easier to read), though I don’t know how you can actually expect people to think the loan company is in the wrong here. You signed an agreement and defaulted on it. All of our rates for loans go up BECAUSE of people like you who can’t pay what you agreed to.
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The Truth, what you may not be aware of is that there has been some confusion here, what is stated in the paper isnt entirely accurate.
My situation is confusing and very complicated as i stated in my previous comment i am not prepared to discuss it on here because it is my business, i was merely clearing up any confusion regarding Cherry Godfrey.
I think paying 75% of the loan total proves that i was totally committed to it, it wasnt like i took out the loan and then said stuff it after a year then refused to pay it that is defiently not the case here , just certain circumstances that brought this situation to how it is.
The Truth, you say it is because of people like me is why the rate of loans go up, may i say something are you attempting to judge me or others ??
i am not a religious person , but in gods eyes we are all equal no matter what, and may i ask what RIGHT you have to judge and criticise me??
Not Suprised, blogger and gilthead thankyou for your comments.
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I thought there were laws protecting people once the person had paid over a certain amount they could not reposes the boat. Also Neil I heard you had offered to pay a large payment after the boat had been arrested but they had refused to take the money. They instead preferred to take the boat you haven’t ticked anybody of in the finance or states departments in the last year by any chance?
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Firestorm, i myself believed there were laws in place to that effect too
Regarding the payment that is correct, i offered a payment in the region of £750 + £600 the following week, the day before the boat had offically been arrested on 25th novemeber to get it released in order to continue to earn a living, as my financial situation was improving up until that time all which was to no avail.
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Of course I’m judging you Neil!
Did you or did you not approach the Press after your court case trying to give them your side of outside of the court setting?
You put yourself out there to be judged, that was your choice when you tried to give more info to the press above what was said in court.
I said it before and I’ll say it again, I’m sure Cherry Godfrey would far rather have their money than your bloney fishing boat! But they clearly considered they weren’t going to get it. Why they thought that only you and they know.
PS. Thanks for the paragraphs, much better.
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Gilthead – I agree that HP is technically different from, say, a secured loan. However, I would argue the principle remains the same as the outcome is the same – people’s livelihoods being taken from them as payment for a debt.
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The Truth, infact the press reporter approached me after the case.
To which i gave them details of the situation which hasnt been published correctly.
As far as Cherry godfrey is concerned, they probaly would rather have the money yes, and if i was in a financial position to give it to them i would, however i am not and seeing that i have had my means to make a living removed, therefore its unlikely now that i am going to be in that position either.
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And just for the record regarding my situation with Cherry Godfrey, at the time of the arrest of the vessel i was £50 in arrears with cherry godfrey and that is “The Truth”.
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PLP
I won’t dwell on this specific case – as that isn’t right.
The parable of debt: …in the days before the coming of camels from the hills of the north Dave son of Frank the Weary had a vision. And lo! This vision told him to buy some land and tools to grow water mellons for sale at the market in Belethbonbezula near the city of Rashemon.
So Dave son of Frank the Weary went to the moolah lenders in Rashemon, the Goldman Sachs. Now the Goldman Sachs were very rich and liked a good idea to make the moolah and said: “my boy listen – we must lend you the moolah as we know there are not enough mellons in these parts”. At this Dave son of Frank the Weary felt a gladness in his heart and a sweilling in his wallet.
But the Goldman Sachs added “beware the cost of failiure Dave son of Frank the Weary – as if you do fail we will squeeze every drop of moolah from your body – with no risk to ourselves, obviously, as we’ve sold the debt on as a ponzi scheme bundled as CDO’s on the AIM market”.
Now Dave son of Frank the Weary had girdled loins and a great heart. He toiled on his new land and sowed his seed verily and with much mirth. Knowing that he would be providing money and mellons to his betrothed, Hannah daughter of Queenie the Lumpen.
But it came to pass that a great mellon eating plague of locusts decended upon his patch and devoured the crop leaving him in ruin. He cried “what am to do? I have no mellons and I owe the Goldman Sachs 1000 moolahs”.
Hearing his cry in the wilderness Josuah the Moolah Juggler came to Dave son of Frank the Weary and said verily unto him “Dave you must pay back the Goldman Sachs the moolah by selling some of your assets”. Dave thought long and sadly replied – “Joshua your words are sooth but I have no assets, my tools are worn with toil and my patch is worthless as I was sold a minger by the estate agent Daphne the Unbeleivable”.
Joshua the Moolah Juggler looked into Dave son of Frank the Weary’s eyes and uttered “Dave, mate, you’re in the cack”.
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Yes Neil, they approached you afterwards, because you sent your acquaintance to find the Press and them you wanted to talk to them eh. Remember, This Is Guernsey.
They’ve published the details you gave them wrong have they, ah well, live by the press die by the press.
So you couldn’t pay…so what should the company that owed you money have done? Let you off the rest because you’d paid some of it? I’m sure you were given different repayment options, they would not have taken you to court simply because you were £50 behind. That certainly wouldn’t have been in their interest. Going to court costs a lot of time and money and they wouldn’t have done so unless they thought it was their last resort.
As Prev said above, if it was just a case of £50 you could have earned that in a few hours in all manner of ways.
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Gilthead
If Dave,son of Frank the Weary,had purchased his melon patch in Guernsey,he could have turned it into a nice little moolah maker by flogging it off as a building plot … as long as the buyer was one of those firms who always seem to gain the necessary permissions after others have tried and failed
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Ray – quite right!
Or mayhaps have it purchased using an outdated and discredited law for the purposes of an extended runway.
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Gilthead
Ouch. That was a low blow!
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Dose not seem fair to take away your tools and boat like you said you would be paid off in July 2012 so you paid alot.
Good Luck
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Gilthead, without the compulsory purchase law we would have neither the reservoir nor the current airport.
It is as valid today as it was then.
You may not like the use of it in the current airport context but that’s not the law’s fault.
I do hate it when poor laws get grief as they are in no position to defend themselves.
The Truth, Defender of the Law.
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Hello Sarah, Thankyou for your concerning comment.
i dont know if you read the press on monday with my story in, yes effectively they were the tools of my trade which i had put alot of time, effort and money into, not just the boat but also spending alot of time making and preparing the fishing gear ( Ropes, lines, marker flag floats etc.
but it goes further than that, it wasnt just a boat to me it was my pride and joy and the reward was something to show for my effort come the end of the loans with Cherry Godfrey which would have ended in July 2012.
as i stated in the paper, the boat was my life, fishing was my passion and livelihood which, which have now been removed.
I can appreciate i did have some debts, and my situation was improving up until the seizure of the boat which then rendered me unable to pay, but bearing in mind that i did make offer of payment for the boat to be released, i just cant see the logic in arresting equipment that a man needs to use to earn his living.
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The Truth – there were laws that used to allow us to beat our wives or buy slaves or burn witches at the stake.
Surely your not suggesting that?
Best of luck if you are.
Ray – apologies. Hope your eyes have stopped watering.
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There a clear and obvious difference though Gilthead, the compulsory purchase law still serves a required purpose for the population of the island as a whole.
But that said, I wish there was a law that meant I could beat my husband and burn that witch who turned me into a newt (I got better).
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Does not seem fair like you said Neil fishing was your livelihood so how can you pay back the money if you are not earning. I think they should give you your boat back give you six months to a year and then look at it again.So least in that time you could pay back some more monies. I guess it does not work like that but that boat you paid off alot like you said 75%
Good luck
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it was only a matter of time!
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Thank you Sarah,
I agree with what you say there, i would have thought common sense would have prevailed here, but obviously not.
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this is what happens when people who are quite happy to borrow money and not repay it back especially in this case when what has been paid back is other peoples money!
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Neil, am sad for you, debt is a killer, and Guernsey is a hard place to get out of it. Alot of have to live in debt to survive or have any decent lifestyle.
My marriage broke up 3 years ago, and my then wife and I had a loan out with a certain bank who totally refused to help us when things went wrong. When we were together, fine, only 1 rent to pay, now though, there’s 2 rents to pay, and it is a struggle to keep meeting monthly payments.
Credit card company too, not interested in circumstances, just in getting their money, on time.
Oh yes, bank conned me into taking out insurance and again with loan companies who I have had loans with in the past, insurance, what a joke, never knew i never had to take it out in the 1st place, over £7,000 insurance to pay with the bank loan and when I did get sick after having a breakdown, I could not claim as the insurance does not cover it.
Once my bank loan is paid, be assured, I will never use the bank or loan company, credit card company again. They have all 1 thing in common, they want their money back no matter what you been through and as much as you try to talk to them, you might as well bang your head against a brick wall.
Might have done me a favor, but, Neil is one example of the attitude is….he was catching up, was there a need to put him through this?
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Some appear not to know the difference between a bank, a finance company, and a charity.
Its rough, but some people can cope with running a profitable business, and some can’t. Those that can’t need to find work without risk, if their business skills are not sufficient to find a profit.
Jo M
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I think people who make these comments, should understand the facts before passing judgment. I doubt if your all perfect!! Frankly its a embarrassing!!.. The way COWARDS kick people when there down. ‘The Truth’. I have little doubt your involved with this!!!!:) Tic…Toc.
There is a common sense approach to sorting out this mess which works well for both parties. However this seems an alien concept. Like hmm!! Neil working for the company until the debt is repayed!! the company taking 100% of what is earn’t!.. Everyones happy……….ROCKET SCIENCE!!!. Appears to of bee a witch hunt from someone at the top of the chain!!!!!!
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smith i think its you who needs to check the facts. Someone who takes out loans from banks, financial institution and friends and dont pay them back then what do they expect-charity! There are people who work exceptionally hard and are unable to get a loan and here you have a case of the complete opposite – fact!
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You’ve got me Smith, I admit it, this bloke nicked my sweets when I was a lad, so I made sure he got his boat nicked now. AHAAHAAAA, what goes around comes around eh!
Back in the real world, you’re suggesting the loan company take all of this blokes profits until they get there money back? I’m not even going to start on why thats utter nonsense because I don’t have enough skin on my fingers tips to type out all the obvious problems with it.
Now, I’m off to go ruin someone elses life from my lofty perch here at the top of the chain.
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As someone who has little respect for the way banks and some people in them operate and even less for some of these loan companies esp in the way they catch people with there misleading advertising i still find it very hard to believe they would have taken this action unless it was a last resort.
I think The Truth and James along with Prev know a fair bit about the facts here?.
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@ *the truth* I get the impression by reading a lot of ur past comments on posts that nothing seems to please u does it! you never have a POSITIVE thing to say about anything or anyone…. Are u workin for the states of Guernsey by any chance? I feel quite sorry for Neil and i am sure that there is a law somewhere preventing a company taking a mans means of living away. He offered to give them over a thousand pounds so he could continue to work and earn. His sister was scare mongered into signing over the boat so it COULD be arrested. That’s not right, and neither is it right for other certain jealous fishermen who are purely stickin the boot in here just for the hell of it. Your competition is currently unable to fish so be satisfied that there are now a few more fish in the sea for u to try and catch and stop judging this guy. Yes i do know him and i am fully aware of the facts, which for legal reasons i can not disclose
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popeye,
At last someone on here that at least knows some of the true facts on this matter, thanks for your comment, yes she was scaremongered and mentally bullied into signing it over.
Another matter of fact i offered them £750 the day before the official arrest took place with a further additional £600 the following week.
And the matter of some fishermen putting the boot in……well i have learnt to expect that, The attitude around that industry here is Everyman for Himself, they simply just cant work together hence why the fishing industry is getting worse, Correct me if im wrong but i believe Guernsey has maybe the only industry in the UK which is like that.
I was one of the younger skippers down the quay that took on the challenge of trying to be successful, due to certain questionable circumstances i had my livelihood, boat removed.
And i cant foresee much of a future industry here in guernsey in fishing as there is not many potential youngsters coming in to replace the older generation of skippers and if you take my case as an example with extortionate loans , the expense just prices it way out of proportion to unexpericenced potential youngsters wanting to get involved in this industry.
So to the population of this island eat your fish while you can because in years to come it might not be so readily available.
Infact in years to come the so called Fish Quay will probaly be reclaimed and used for something else ( Offices and banks etc ) but that aint going to bring fresh fish to your plate.
P.S. Popeye i’d like you to identify yourself to me, if you know my number give me a call.
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