Half a kilo of cannabis in her bra
Thursday 31st March 2011, 4:40PM BST.
A SALFORD woman who travelled to Guernsey by ferry had cannabis resin hidden between the two bras she was wearing.
Kelly Davenport, 28, arrived with her seven-year-old daughter on 8 December last year, the Royal Court heard.
Customs officers found that she was carrying a minimal amount of clothes for her and her daughter and no toiletries.
When told that she was going to be searched, she told officers about the drugs in her underwear.
The drugs, weighing 505g, had a street value in Guernsey of between £10,000 and £15,000.
Davenport was jailed for two and half years.
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Busted!
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At least she made a clean breast of it !
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dejaVu- POTY!
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Although its impossible to stop all drugs reaching the island some how or another, i think its good to show there is a zero tolerance policy for those who get caught.
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Total disgrace this young woman getting jail.
Injustice to the extreme and child abuse, taking into account her 7 yr old has been severed from her Mum.
Guernsey court needs to look at itself and sort priorities.
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It’s a fair cup!
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@ Lorre
Think the mum should have put her child before anything else.
No sympathy
You play with fire…
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@ Lorre
Would you be saying the same if it was the childs father who got caught smuggling drugs? Is a woman who would smuggle drugs, presumably with her daugher along if she was carrying clothes for her, a suitable gaurdian for for a seven year old anyway?
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Lorre:
?!? A mother who takes her 7 year old on a drug run is ‘severed’ from her daughter? It sounds like she should have been severed long, long ago. I only hope social services are now working to find carers for her who are actually fit to be parents.
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Lorre dont’t talk rubbish she knowingly broke the law therefore she must take the punishment, and what a poor mother teaching the child crime at such an early age
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Guernsey this week … Drug courier caught with 505gms of cannabis worth 10K gets two and a half years
North London this week … Drug dealer caught with 90gms of cocaine,90gms of crystal meth,100 ecstasy tabs,85gms of amphetamine and three bin bags of cannabis together worth 50K, under the new UK sentencing guidelines gets a twelve month suspended sentence
Suggestion … Wouldn’t it make sense for all Guernsey crack heads to move to the UK … there’s usually a boat in the morning
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Lorre.Is this woman fit to have a child? The Guernsey Courts are doing the child a favour by keeping the mother’s (I use the term loosely)influence away from her seven year old daughter. What a great role model,taking your 7 year old child on a drug importation run. Those are commercial quantities and she no doubt knew the risks otherwise why were the drugs hidden?
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Lorre – don’t blame the Guernsey courts for seperating the mother from the daughter. This was a serious crime committed, made even worse because she brought her daughter along with her presumably thinking she would be less likely to get caught. This was a premeditated crime and fully deserves the prison sentence. I hope the daughter has a loving family she can stay with who will bring her up teaching her right from wrong.
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she could be the best mother in the world,theres reasons behind everything
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Its only cannabis for god sake. Should be legalised anyway.
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Lorre
YOU are the disgrace if that is what you think , that a mother is not fit to have a child if all she can think about is making profit from illegal activities.
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If this woman had been caught bringing it into my City from the ferry she would have been bailed within hours and given a fine in court. You will never stop cannibis being available due to such a high demand. Here on the mainland the police have been fighting a loosing battle since the 1960s when only a small section of people used it. Its less harmful than the dreaded booze which destroys many lives and kills many thousands of alchol addicts each year.Take a look at the violence on the Island every week ,is this cannibis related ofcourse not, its the booze.
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Wiliam the reason is to make money illegally no person who takes there 7 year old child to committ crime is a good mother, ss thats irrelevant it is illegal.
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An absurd waste of law enforcement resources. Six million people in Britain use cannabis regularly – not surprising when you realise it is 100 times safer and 1000 times less toxic than alcohol. We already waste billions every year in a futile attempt to stop it. Why not tax and regulate and realise the benefits?
http://peterreynolds.wordpress.com/2011/02/09/this-absurd-waste-of-police-time-and-resources/
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Ray your comment is brilliant!!!!
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Well said SS!
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Neil – the clue is in the title of this website. This is NOT the UK.
Cannabis is not benign. A little bit here and there will do no harm, but regular use is not good, just as regular boozing is not good. But just because alcohol is legal (for various socialogical and cultural reasons) and the abuse of alcohol is the cause of various crime, it does not follow that cannabis should be legal.
And don’t be naive, this amount of cannabis is serious. The profits would fund other criminality.
Peter Reynolds – it was hardly a waste of resources – the customs officers were standing there anyway. Or are you saying that we should not bother having on duty customs officers? I’ve not bothered linking to your own blog, thanks all the same. When you say that “we” waste billions every year, I take it that you are not from around here. I think that a sizeable majority of the island’s population support the low tolerance that our system has for such offences. We like to maintain a nice environment, eh?
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2.5 years is ridiculous, it’s only cannabis not anything dangerous like tobacco or alcohol.
Too much misinformation about drugs, people hear the word drugs and think deadly substance, people have been smoking cannabis for longer than there have been people in the western hemispehre.
Tobacco is the most dangerous drug on the planet killing more than every other drug combined and not only is it legal but our government profits enormously from it’s sale, that’s right the biggest drug pushers on the island are the states!
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Sorry are these articles the script for Jeremy Kyle or Loose Women. So people do some peculiar things, but this island’s attitude and sentencing are representative of a by-gone era. Your Judiciary are passing sentences without regard to the world today. Why not go further back and start stoning people. The Police need something to do so let them stop 40 mile per hour drivers, lecture them for forty-five minutes then stone them.
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Storm in a B Cup.
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Just been reading of a case that happened recently,a 38year old driver,under the influece of Cannabis,drove through a red traffic light,hit another car,then skidded onto the pavement where he killed four people.Until we hang the peddlers the drug war will never be won,too much profit to be made,Oh yes,I know about the evils of alcohol too,but who is going to ban that???
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..its just a bit of pot for godsake!
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I am sorry but she deserved this. what if she is smoking around her child? she is 7 years old for god sake! some people in this world cant have children and she has one and exposes her to a drug
if people are wanting their fix so much go to amsterdam where you can buy it and smoke it legally.
plus i know plenty of people who have smoked for years and their minds are not the same as they were. this drug does have bad side affects its not just alcohol and i know enough about this due to an alcoholic parent.
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I don’t see that the drugs are the problem BUT they are still illegal .
What I do see is that some innocent 7 year old has been dragged into crime unwittingly at an early age THEN that’s where things change – anyone saying this is ok can almost be classed in the same genre as its ok for a paedophile to abuse children , You can almost imagine that back home in Manchester that child is subjected to allsorts of the normal hassles associated with drug use.
If you read the whole story she admits to debt problems and also to smoking cannabis and that she was being paid £750 to carry the drugs, You can bet that she hasn’t admitted to a lot more than she has and it is reported that she has changed her story more than once…
I have no problem with drugs – just keep them away from me
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just to let yous all no,kelly was in debt to a loan shark,it was near xmas and she needed a way out,SHE IS A GOOD MOTHER,she was promised a way out,if youve not been in that boat dont comment,YOU LET ME COMENT BEFORE SO LET ME COMENT NOW,DRUGS DONT WORK,but if youve got to feed,clothe and sort xmas out,put yourself in that position,LOVE U KEL,U SHOULD AV LET US NO XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
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Lorre
Your right about the child abuse.
Useing a 7 year old as part of her “tools of her trade” is child abuse but it was her doing the abuseing.
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being very close to kelly i can tell you that she is agood person who made a bad mistake and she is now paying the price a price that she strongly regrets,has for paul who made a comment about her, dont put her in the same league as paedophiles.her kids are not under any sort of abuse,they have loving grandparents taking care of them.
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paul, and what about all the parents who take their children to the clubs and pubs and consume alcohol in front of them,these kids will grow up and do the same,some will become alcoholics and some will die from alcohol abuse,or is that alcohol is a better drug than the others,more repectable you may say ! Face facts booze is a killer …legal i know, but far more dangerous,and dont you just love it,CHEERS! I drink to your health.
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dont diss my cuzz man we all make mistakes and she made 1 get over it her child is gettin loved shell be mooching now in brydon close with her lovely little brother its got nout to do with none of yous so dont get involved end of story love you kelly x
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she dont smoke it she dont take it she had problems would you like it if your kids woke up christmas morning with no christmas presents thats how she felt have youse ever watched banged up abroad we only got 1 love peace out xxx
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to paul who made the comment before trust me never ever been arrested in her life to class her as a paoedophile you must be sick drugs and sick men no comparison,idiots like you keep peodos out of jail !
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well said jane kelly is a good women who will do any thing for anyone she is a good mum and doesnt everybody make mistakes use dont know her why use all jugdeing a book by is cover and making it sound worst than what it was
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Lot of comments there.
Fact is Kelly didn’t commit a crime.
Not for real eh?
Only in dozey guernsey courts world.
A planet that prosecuted John Louis Symphorien 400 plus times, driving him to an early death.
As would said before,’just some blow’.
But serious crime, child abuse crime committed by court.
Reunite them 4 fx sake.
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It’s very easy for those who have never been in a desperate situation to condemn this poor lady. Walk a mile in her shoes before you pass judgement. I’ve been unemployed and have sold drugs to feed my kids, I’ve been in debt and the social payments don’t cover the interest from loan sharks.
Her child was at no time in danger, had this worked out she was just accompanying her mum on a ay trip. I do wonder what planet some of these self rightous people are on, let me tell you if your children are hungry, ig their clothes are threadbare and the baliff is closing in you WILL DO whatever is necessary to provide for them.
I’m very sorry to hear what has happened, it’s a ridicoul sentance for a minor crime and the insane system that thinks it’s better to seperate this woman from her child rather than help her should be condemned.
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Another sob story from the friends of a drug runner who was quite happy to peddle them in Guernsey. She brought her daughter to try and look innocent. It didn’t work. She got caught. Maybe social services where she lives should be told about her and what she did
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Guernsey, where the sun shines on the drunks and pill poppers, but smoke some herb and you get banged up in a cold dark grey cell.
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It is not for smoking but bringing in over £10000 of an illegal drug for money.
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To all you people slating this woman,ask your self one question, have I ever been in possession of alcohol or tobbaco whilst in the company of children.
If the answer is yes hypocrite springs to mind.
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Forums?contain more sh** than your average sewage lorry,peoples misguided opinions due to not knowing the facts or anything about said subject!
I only wanted to know what the weather was doing and got sucked in for a mo!
Turns out the weather is going to be nice later so I’m off out for a nice cycle ride around our beautifull island.Terry Langlois needs to know what he is on about!you really need to get out more.life forces innocent law abiding people to do wrong sometimes.some of the worlds greatest people have admitted to drug use.anyway I’m off for that cycle ride,join me sometime Terry it might de stress your troubled mind ha ha!
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aiden owens 15 yearo
What language is that your speaking in? man.
Actually its got nothing to do with you because she got caught in Guernsey not the UK.
Lorre
Thats one of the funniest posts i`ve read, do you have anymore “facts” for us?
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aiden owens 15 yearo: One assumes that English isn’t your first language judging by the grammar,punctuation and spelling in your post.
It became our business when taxpayers like myself have to pay out hard earnt tax money on your drug running friend. I doubt the Court costs will be recovered and it costs around £35k a year to feed and house the inmates. Explain where the justice is for me in that? I support the current stance against drugs locally and feel that if the Courts handed down stiffer penalties it would be a step in the right direction, anything to keep the low lifes that peddle misery out of my island has to be a good thing. One only has to see what sort of people are involved in drug gangs when you see the outcome of running gun battles on the streets of South London resulting in the shooting of that innocent five year old girl this week.
If the Courts are more lenient in the UK, I suggest she stays that side of the Channel.It’s a good job she wasn’t trying to import drugs into certain Asian countries where she would be looking at the death sentence upon conviction.
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Ex Offender
I Have and still am walking a million miles in her shoes but I care enough about my family to make sure that when my debt is cleared in 2037 – yes that’s right ,26 years time at the current rate of payment I will have done it all by myself.
My debts are not drug related but a part of the current situation and business collapse to do with the fact that most people no longer go to bars/clubs as often as they did.
I am sure you will agree that if you do the crime you do the time . There was NO NEED to get a child involved.
and to the people who say I am wrong in my words then that’s your choice but many people also say its child abuse, sorry but as you quite rightly say there are 2 sides to every story , she should have left the child where she was safe and not put her in possible danger..
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Fact is Paul, SHE WASN’T DOING A CRIME.
Not really eh.
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Taffy crisp – before slating me, I suggest you re-read my post. I am not passing judgment on her as a person. I can easily understand that in desperate times people do stupid things.
But I was responding to those posters who say that this was “not a crime” or that 2.5 years was excessive or that it was “just a bit of pot”. She was not done for possession, this was smuggling. She would have dealt directly with some serious criminals, and was directly assisting serious crime, including the funding of other crime. And she involved her child.
She may have been desperate (although I note that the best reason aiden owens can put forward is that her kids had no Christmas presents, which hardly qualifies) and yes, people do desperate things at times. But one can understand the position that she was in but still feel that she has done wrong and should be punished if caught.
With your line of reasoning, every criminal who felt desperate would go unpunished. Hardly the basis for a civilised society.
And to those of you comparing this to the use of alcohol or tobacco – this was not use, it was smuggling.
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oh, and Taffy crisp, I am actually heading out on my bike for a ride now. I’ll look out for you.
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“it costs around £35k a year to feed and house the inmates”
Yes, Saints, which is why in this case she should have been given a much shorter or suspended sentence and a lifetime ban from re-entering the island – not because she’s a woman/a mother but because 30 months is excessively harsh and I would have said the same had it been a childless man smuggling this stuff in.
I also think 3/4 year sentences for paedos who commit ‘virtual’ crimes online is excessively harsh. What concerns me is the cost to the taxpayer. Our prison must be bursting at the seams now with mules and paedos who have been given sentences that are much too long. Time for a major reappraisal of sentencing policy.
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Why isn’t she being deported? She’s not even local.
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all yous stuck up people who spend there lives judjin other people n commenting on stuff u only no half a story 2 get a life n have a spliff n chill out u dont no wat ur missin she was doin u a favour haha. kelly d i love u c u soon sis xxx
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Well, I would have sent her down for longer. This is a nasty drug that leads to many issues and addictions. I have worked in Psychiatry for 25 yrs and see it all the time. She’s a muppet and doesn’t give a stuff about her kids. That’s Britain for you. Send out a clear message. Feel so sorry for the kid. Hope she learns her lesson. We all need cash but there has to be a line drawn somewhere. If it was for personal use, then her kid is best away from her until she gets with the programme.
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NO NEED 2 FEEL SORRY 4 THE KID N SHE AINT NO MUPPET SHE JUST MADE A MISTAKE N YE SHE AS LEARNT A LESSON…………….. NOW ALL YOU BUSY PEOPLE KEEP UR THOUGHTS 2 UR SELF N SHE AINT FORCING ANY1 2 SMOKE IT SHE DONT SMOKE IT ER SELF SO KEEP UR COMMENTS 2 URSELF
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toni kerwin
Looked up the word judjin but cant find it:)
but it does seem like yor missin a few tings.
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Hows about a Facebook campaign to free her?
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Deport her.. why should my tax pay her kep for 2 and half years !!
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Lorre
Excellent idea
That would help publicise to the rest of the world that Guernsey does not tolerate poison pushers no matter what their home circumstances may be
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I’d make her eat the lot, in one go.
“Weed” soon see how harmless this substance is.
2.5 years is a very light sentence for a drug trafficker.
One of our finance workers could get longer than that for failing to report a suspicion.
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I am fascinated by the pseudo text/misspelt/grammatically incorrect/unable to turn off caps on a keyboard (SHOUTING!!!!!!!!!!) comments from Kelly’s ‘supporters’.
If that’s the result of the more liberally minded UK, where the residents themselves complain loudly and regularly that their country is totally and utterly BROKEN, then (despite my own somewhat more liberal views) I think I’ll stay living in little ol’ Guernsey, backwards, old fashioned, intolerant perhaps….
but which has wisely chosen to not follow in the UK’s footsteps, where they appear to be producing people who can’t even speak their native language.
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This offence is not one that would do much harm to the end user of the substance being smuggled.
The fact she used her daughter as a prop & cloak of maternal dependency is an aggravating factor.
She has been served a harsh lesson. No doubt others will be put off by the sentence.
Prison rarely rehabilitates many that experience the little it has to offer. If anything it’s a place where minor offenders get to learn the tricks of the trade from other more experienced career criminals. A school of bright ideas & brainstorming for individuals that are challenged educationally & those where most propositions are worthy of consideration through nothing other than sheer desperation.
For offences that many would class as relatively trivial, like this, I feel it’s high time a system was in place where the perpetrator could be given the option of doing community service projects that earn them extra time off the sentence total.
Maybe a month reduction for every hundred hours as a sensible starting point. This woman is a mother. Her desperation to be back with her daughter would indicate she would be a fine candidate for such a scheme & would present a very low risk for further offending.
The child is being punished too. Give people other options of paying back society for their mistakes.
A structured scheme could be implemented that would help reduce the likelihood of re-offending & be useful to help meet the costs of incarceration. It could also help with offering the offenders experience towards a vocation upon release.
The system needs a fresh approach. Productivity is not a consideration at present.
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Good post, Paul
Although it is definitely a debate worth having, the question whether cannabis should be legalised is irrelevant in the context of this case. Until such time as the law is changed and despite what some people on this forum might think, importing cannabis into the island remains a criminal offence under Guernsey law with harsh penalties.
However – it seems pretty evident by the case information provided that Ms Davenport was naive in the extreme, certainly not a hardened drug smuggler. It is well known that drug dealers prey on vulnerable people to act as mules. They are the real criminals here and our law enforcement efforts should be firmly concentrated on them, not a naive woman.
My personal view on this case is that, as Martino suggests, she should be barred from the island with a suspended sentence that is immediately activated if she attempts to return.
Locking her up for 2 years achieves very few positive results either for Guernsey, Ms Davenport or society. At the very least efforts should be made to move her to a prison nearer Salford so that she can remain in contact with her family (and the added bonus of saving the Guernsey taxpayer a fortune).
As a final point it’s also worth noting that she will now be marked on the national police database for drugs offences so her days as a drug mule are over – you can rest assured she is a marked woman and will now be searched every time she gets near a border post.
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Scarlett
I think you’ll find that they are a product of liar Blair’s education,education,education mantra
Get rid of the 11+ at our peril !
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She knew what she was doing and she knew the risks.
No point bleating now, drug trafficker. That will look good on any CV, won’t it?
And to quote from Porridge:
Godber: I’m only in here due to tragic circumstances.
Fletch: Which were?
Godber: I got caught
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Dude chill everyone smokes pot
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Mr G
| April 3, 2011 at 12:13 pm
Why isn’t she being deported? She’s not even local.
How about the UK deport every Channel Islander they are currently holding in UK prisons now and in the future. I wonder how Les Nicolles would cope?
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Paul & P Le Page
Is there no place left for a deterrent penalty?
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Paul & Paul Le Page – two very good posts, taking the discussion beyond the initial “it’s not a crime” or “she’s got a kid and so should not be punished” reaction. It is a crime, punishment is required, but the nature of the punishment can take many forms.
I would expect that her sentence will be served in the UK anyway, for the child’s sake (in which case, I believe that the UK parole rules apply).
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If her literacy skills are as good as her supporters then maybe some time and an education in prison might do her some good.
Then she might get a job when she gets out and not have any debt!
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Deterrent penalties don’t work Ray, even when they’re spelled out correctly. I too believe the two Pauls have opened the debate into the right areas. We must be able to come up with better and more cost effective punishments/deterrents than the counter productive sentencing policies we have at the moment. I resent the fact that we are going to fritter away 70 grand or more putting this woman up for the next two years. I’d prefer much shorter, sharper custodial sentences with community work thrown in, followed by deportation.
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Ray – I don’t believe a sentence should be over-influenced by the “deterrent” factor.
Making an example of someone with a heavy handed sentence in order to deter others is not justice – you should only be punished for the crime you committed and I firmly believe the first duty of the courts when sentencing is to make the punishment fit the crime.
In this case, taking into account the circumstances surrounding the case (that I am aware of) and the offence itself I am of the opinion that other sentencing options should have been investigated.
The drug dealers that live champagne lifestyles on the back of people such as Ms Davenport and drug addicts though….now they are another matter altogether.
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I’d suspect, given the time she has already spent on remand & her personal circumstances, the reality of her spending much time when she is transferred to the UK would be negligible.
She would most certainly receive a suspended sentence in the UK for a similar amount.
I’d be shocked if she did not receive parole automatically on her first application.
It would be sensible to sentence using a ratcheting system. Offenders could earn substantial discounts for things like shopping their supplier & providing information that helps prosecute the recipient. Bring in legislation to make it workable even after sentence has been passed.
After a vulnerable person has had many months to consider what their life has been turned into, to profit mainly others, many would lose patience pretty fast.
If it’s the case that non local mules are being sentenced harshly by the court then being paroled a few weeks after they are transferred to a UK prison this would also need looking into.
The island could still take a hard line but allow the offender to make amends for the error of their ways. Help them to help themselves redeem their way out of the situation.
It would make life a lot riskier for the suppliers. The majority are very confident about not getting punished if things don’t work out to plan.
In most cases it boils down to losing a small amount in cash & the disappointment of not being able to enjoy spending the many thousands from the profit.
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So what real alternatives are there, do-gooders?
A hefty fine?
The woman was skint, which is why she did the mule run.
Community service? Are we going to ship her over at weekends to pick up dog poo or clean up graffiti, or hire her out to the UK to do the same?
Bound over to go away and not return isn’t much of a deterrent for a non-local and isn’t much use for anything else now is it?
But it would encourage many others to have a “crack” at our overly soft regime.
A custodial sentence is a deterrent to others, particularly when backed up with a determination on behalf of the authorities to make it stick.
Martino – my idea was a hell of a lot cheaper.
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out of interest, does anyone know if we can prevent UK residents from coming to the island, or do they have complete freedom of movement?
Obviously there are housing controls and right to work documents, but if they are just coming to visit, are we allowed to stop them (eg if they have abused our hospitality in the past)?
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ewwwww whos do u all think u are slaggin a salford girl well am 1 ov kellys best m8s n shes a top mum n always will b !! so dnt even go ther n dis her nor her family whos do u fink u are,, my m8 kelly is a top girl n a top m8 ,, do u think shes wants 2 b there , shes duin tha tym now , so wats tha problem. lv n miss u kelly, its not 4eva see u soon bbe ,, mwah xxxxxxxx
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Paul le Page
Sorry my friend.You usually make a lot of sense but weakening our deterrent sentencing policy would only profit Condor as they rake in the fares of the hoards ready to bring in the poison at the risk of a gentle do gooder slap on the wrist
Interesting headline today,’Addict robs girl,15, to buy drugs’
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Terry Langlois
Yes. An offender can be bound over not to return to the island for a term decided by the court.
Those that break the order are arrested. They are put before the court to account for the breach then re-sentenced & possibly deported after the sentence has been served.
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Ray – I’m not talking about weakening sentences, simply having sentences that (a) fit the crime and (b) benefit society in the long term.
I’m not excusing the crime, but I believe that for this particular case, time served + the sentences I described above ARE a deterrent to someone who, to all intents and purposes, is most likely nothing more than a vulnerable individual used by drug dealers – a pawn in their nefarious game.
For the record I would have supported a harsher sentence if the drug in question was crack cocaine, or if the quantity was significantly higher.
Also for the record I wholeheartedly support extremely tough sentences for the drug dealers who ruin the lives of users and mules alike. Whilst Ms Davenport is sitting in her cell with her life in tatters, they are most likely laughing over their champagne and caviar.
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Paul – thanks
louise oxton – hilarious!! you’ve got the language so perfectly that I thought your post was genuine for a minute…
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louise oxton
Can you speak English?
And who does this Salford girl think she is bringing drugs into our Island?.
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Customs / Guernsey Border Agency are just fantastic. Well done guys and girls on another great interception.
I think the court should consider making the offence an aggrevated one where children are used to try and put enforcement off their stride.
And for those of you who say ‘it’s only cannabis’, either grow up, or learn to read. It causes long term mental problems which are well known and documented.
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darren:
And for those of you who say ‘it’s only cannabis’, either grow up, or learn to read. It causes long term mental problems which are well known and documented.
—————
Poppycock. Why don’t you learn to read material other than whats in the mainstream media.
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Darren, maybe you should grow up (or even open your eyes) and realise that prohibition really doesn’t work.
@ Louise Oxton….brilliant!
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Darren
I think you’ll find that cannabis has been deemed less harmful than many legal drugs, including alcohol and tobacco.
Should we imprison the people that import those drugs and cause hundreds of deaths each year locally? Or are they ok because they’re legal and we raise taxes from them?
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Darren – The comparison with alcohol is often used, and although it’s not always valid there is a case to say that legalising then regulating cannabis and focusing law enforcement efforts on harder drugs like crack cocaine has its merits.
I haven’t made up my mind fully on the cannabis legalisation issue however I believe it is time for a mature and open debate on the subject.
Contrary to your assertion, I think that being “grown up” about the subject is to have an open, mature debate on it rather than just entrenching ourselves in either extreme viewpoint.
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@Aiden Owens & @ Loiuse Oxton
Forgive me if firstly I translate your comments into readable english. I hope I have understood what you were so eloquently trying to say.
You say it has nothing to do with the law abiding citizens of Guernsey. of course it does.
This young women tried to smuggle drugs into Guernsey in order to ensure that our local population became addicted. Perhaps she has made numerous trips before and probably intended to make numerous trips again.
Why should we tolerate people coming to Guernsey to supply drugs?
She knew excatly what she was doing and the risk she was taking. This is well summarised by the statement ” If you can’t do the time don’t do the crime”
I am not medically qualified to understand whether or not cannabis is addictive or dangerous but written reports suggest it is and also suggest that dealers who successfully sell Cannabis often move on to cocaine and crack and heroin.
She was dealing She did not just have a little on her for persoanl use. She was dealing and has to face the consequences. Goodness knows how many other lives she has already ruined by supplying drugs.
I understand that many of her friends want to support her and she probably is a very good Mum and may have just been desparate for money to support her child. However that is no excuse for ruining other people’s lives by pushing drugs.
Perhaps these people from Salford believe that Guernsey is an easy place to peddle drugs? well they know differently now and I congratulate the Border Agency for their fine work.
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Phil – the assessment of harm is carried out in many different ways and from different perspectives. A recent UK drug adviser was sacked for (correctly) stating that the use of heroin is less harmful to society overall than the use of alcohol. The press reported it as if he had said that it was better to shoot up than to have a glass of wine, which is clearly not correct. What he was saying was that whilst an individual is better off drinking responsibly than taking heroin, for society as a whole alcohol causes more harm because it is more prevalent.
The same applies to cannabis. It is less harmful to society than alcohol, because the effect of alcohol on society includes all of those who abuse it (whether getting into a drunken brawl on a Saturday night, or causing domestic violence and the break up of families). Cannabis does not have that same effect on others.
But the correct comparison is not between a spliff each evening on the one hand, and violent alcoholism on the other. The comparision should be between equally responsible use of either.
I have witnessed at first hand regular smokers losing their mental edge over time. I have not seen the same with regular but responsible drinkers. If you asked any cannabis smoker whether it was doing them any harm they would say no, but it needs to be someone on the outside who makes that assessment. I did, which is why I stopped my moderate and occasional usage.
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I think it’s awful that a young child has been separated from her mother however, the fact remains she broke the law…
We could save a lot of money by saying off you go and instead of 30 months if you ever come back to the island it will be 60 months. That will mean we don’t have to pay for her to be kept and will mean she won’t be back !!!
The best part of all would mean she would be back with her seven year old. Everyone makes mistakes in life. But sometimes it just seems to make sense to bend the rules.
Keep the laws, change the sentencing for criminals importing drugs.
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Terry Langlois –
out of interest, does anyone know if we can prevent UK residents from coming to the island, or do they have complete freedom of movement?
Obviously there are housing controls and right to work documents, but if they are just coming to visit, are we allowed to stop them (eg if they have abused our hospitality in the past)?
In the past UK residents came to Guernsey under the pretext of “having a holiday” entire families would come and stay in “bucket & Spade” B&B’s, they would spend whole days walking through the shops carefully spending nothing before retiring to their B&B for a bowl of soup and a sandwich. If any were found to be enjoying it they were shipped post haste to Jersey where a harsher sentence was served at the local Pontins.
Guernsey customs have been unable to prevent them from entering the island but have cleverly manipulated the economic climate to ensure closure of the B&B’s. Left with nowhere to stay they retailiated by working for the banks and gaining 5 year licences, many are now integrating into society by steathily marrying locals. It is thought that their covert invasion will be complete when the last true Guernseyman Mulvie Le Torode relocates to the Ecrehos taking with him his bean crock recipe.
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Lorre… I don’t know if your comments are serious, but if they are then whether or not you agree with the sentence (and yes it’s unfortunate that her daughter will suffer) – she is being punished for breaking the law. A lot of people think cannabis should be legal, but the fact remains that here in Guernsey it is not. There is no “she wasn’t doing a crime, well not really eh” about it. She intentionally broke the law and she did it because drugs have a high street value over here. Why else do you think people risk bringing it here instead of selling back in the UK??
As for Louise Oxton, maybe you need to do a stretch as well, I’m pretty sure you can learn some basic grammar in Les Nicolles. You could even share a cell with your “top mate”.
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damo
It’s very dangerous to profile the perfect candidate for drug dealers to use as mules. Many involved in the drug trade are clever business people.
They will exploit every weakness to make a profit. The system needs to be geared towards unsettling their comfortable behind the scenes lifestyles.
Harsher sentences with discounts offered for those who choose to help themselves is the way forward.
It would be logistically difficult to implement. It is the only workable way to get a grip on a situation that is continually being lost.
I wonder how many mules would happily do an extra couple of years for a dealer that was paying them a few hundred quid?
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@ damo
This lady did not make a mistake as you put it. She didnt drive through a red light or drive 5 miles above the speed limit.
In the cold light of day she deliberately came to Guernsey to deal drugs so she could profit from those in society who are too weak to resist the temptation of taking drugs even though it is against the law.
She is a drug dealer and has been sentenced as such.
Her mistake was coming to Guernsey thinking she could get away with it. She gave no thought to the damage she would cause or the lives she would ruin.
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@ Jane Devenport & Williamowens
Kelly cannot be that good a person if she was happy to deal drugs to those in society who are too weak to resist.
She deserves everything she has got.
It seems those based in Salford who seem to know kelly want to excuse her crime because she was in debt and a mother. I have every sympathy for the awful predicament she may have found herself in but there are other routes rather than turn to crime and ruin other peoples lives by becoming a drug dealer.
I have had friends who lives have been ruined because their children or loved ones have been sucked into to the horrifying world of drugs. kelly was fueling this world and did not think twice about trying to supply others with her drugs.
for all we know she has been doing this for years and would have continued to do so if she had not been caught.
Well done to the Guernsey Border Agency and to the Guernsey courts. Just a shame that the Guernsey tax payer has to pay to keep her accomodated and fed for several years but at least another drug dealer is off the streets and hopefully her sentence may deter others from coming to Guernsey to ply their filthy trade.
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Lorre| April 2, 2011 at 11:10 pm
Fact is Paul, SHE WASN’T DOING A CRIME.
Not really eh.
You are kidding right? How was she found guilty in a court of law and sentenced to time in prison if drug importation for the purpose of selling was not a crime?
I cannot take any thing you say seriously if this is your argument.
bring drugs into the island and face the consequences. Regardless of how great a mum/mate/sister this girl was, she commited a crime and got caught. tough luck. Every one should now be aware of the lack of tolerance on drug crime in Guernsey.
Oh, and learn to spell – this isn’t a text message board where there are limited characters!
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Another guernsey shambles
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i dont give a damm wat all yous think ok,, you,s dont know her and i dnt care about your comments ,, so in a bit and its ok wen your ppl do IT ,, plebsssss , lv u kel xxxxx
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louise oxton – no wait, are you saying that you are actually genuine? Or have you just taken the wind up to the next level? It is just so hard to tell.
But seriously, you’ve got to be having a laugh.
You are, aren’t you?
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Am more than Happy to stress that Kelly is not a criminal, that she did not commit a crime.
4 sure she got busted here but for no crime.
Not for real eh?
Herbs in her bras???
AS I first posted re the above report,
the court committed the crime in separating her from her 7 yr old daughter.
Brutal,unthinking re consequences,harsh punishment.
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lorre – of course you are right. you keep telling yourself that her criminal record is a fiction.
but back in the real world that does not really help her, does it? because she does have a criminal record and that will follow her for a long time to come.
maybe you should stay off the herbs for a bit yourself.
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lorre
Why don’t you have a chat with the Guernsey Border Agency on their freephone line 0800 318 318
They’re always willing to listen
If you can convince them that your views on drug smuggling are correct there may even be a reward
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Wheather its a “crime” or not isn’t really the point. In Saudi Arabia adultary is, and can be punishable by stoning to death. However most forum posters wouldn’t be saying “The Laws the Law”, “Zero tolerence”, “They knew what they where doing, think of the children” about some poor women in Riyadh who’s about to be executed.
Guernsey needs to understand it is out of step of Europe and USA on its sentencing policies and many of its views.
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When I have money troubles, I like to do a little thing called work, there are numerous advantages to this.
The first is that it doesn’t usually take two and a half years to get myself out of my debt induced woes.
The second is that I can see my kids and family every day.
The third is that I don’t cause people to write about my life on an unnecessarily long comments thread on the internet.
And with that everything, I am sure you will agree is peachy.
And before the naysayers pipe in, you can still work and be a mum (or dad), especially, as you all claim, if you have close ‘frendz’ and ‘fam’ to help out.
Now, where was I, oh that’s right, the real world.
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lorre – you say:-
“Am more than Happy to stress that Kelly is not a criminal, that she did not commit a crime.”
How can smuggling drugs into Guernsey where cannabis is illegal not be a crime? I am genuinely intrigued to know how you came to this conclusion.
Whether or not people think that cannabis should be legalised or not, it is still illegal to be in possession of it. Fact.
It is very sad that the daughter will be without her mother but as others have said “if you can’t do the time….”
I’ve been a single mother, I’ve been so desperate that I’m scraping the bottom of my purse to get together pennies to buy a litre of milk for my child but I didn’t turn to illegal activities for an extra bit of cash. The promise to make a quick buck does not usually work and even more so where drugs are involved.
Thank you John for interpreting Aiden Owens & Loiuse Oxton’s posts, I could not make head nor tail of it!
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matt – I think you’ve missed the point. This is not a case of Guernsey criminalising something that is generally accepted elsewhere. I do not know of a single country where smuggling £10k+ of cannabis across its borders would not be a criminal offence.
Every nation maintains that this action is wrong. The only difference is in how they treat that crime. Just because some parts of Europe might choose to punish this less than we do, for a variety of reasons, is of no concern to us. Why should we not have greater sentences for things that are indisputedly “wrong”?
The difference between a suspended sentence on the one hand, and 2.5 years imprisonment (less parole) on the other is a relatively minor difference compared to your example of “no crime committed” on the one hand and “sentenced to death by stoning” on the other. And that is before you even get into the issue of whether the death penalty is justifiable at all, let alone by stoning – which is what causes most of the outcry about such cases.
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@ lorre and Loiuse oxton
I am seriously impressed with your ability to write in such a style that it takes quite some time to understand what you are attempting to say.
Congratulations to Jeff on his post. Lorre and Louise Oxton really do need to get into the real world.
Lorre they were not herbs in kelly’s bra they were drugs. In the real world they are quite clearly defined as drugs. If they were herbs why was she hiding them in her bra?
You lose your arguement through your inability to string two words together in understandable English and your refusal to accept thet this lady got caught smuggling drugs.
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Ray – She had 505 grams, which would cost about £1.00 to £1.50 per gram to buy in the UK. For a first time offender very few if any European countries would imprison someone for 750 pounds or euro’s worth of drugs. In most circumstances it would be delt with by way of a caution, fine or in rare cases a suspended sentence.
It is incompresheniable that Guernsey’s policy is correct in this sense compared with vast majority of our nieghbours.
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Sorry Ray, I ment Terry. Serves me right for doing two things at once.
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for all you perfect people who do nothing but slaughter the girl take a look at your own lives and get a life, have you never done nothing wrong? PERFECT PEOPLE (WHATEVER) FREE FREE KELLY
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AND CHEERS FOR THE ONES WHO DONT
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this is funny reading. allthough i struggle to see how there is any case for the defence. drugs are illegal in guernsey, its illegal to import drugs into guernsey. she imported drugs, got caught, game over.
to try and claim that she is innocent or whatever doesnt wash with me.
too bad. no sympathy here
louise oxton, your posts are absolutely superb.
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matt – let’s consider this further. The drugs she was carrying have a street value of £750 in the UK, or a reported street value of £10,000 here. This huge price discrepancy must be due to lack of supply in Guernsey, which tends to suggest that our policy is getting the intended results, unlike those of Europe. So it seems maybe our policy is correct, after all.
(by the way, I am not debating whether it is right that it is banned. the fact is that it is banned, so what is wrong with enforcing it properly?)
jane davenport – it is not about being perfect and I don’t think many of the posts are criticising Kelly at all (she has already been punished). Most of the posts are reacting to the people who claim that she did nothing wrong in the first place, or that she should be forgiven because her child has no Christmas presents. We all mess up every now and again, but when we do we should accept responsibility for it.
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matt
You say we are out of step? so do you think we should change and become more like those countries with a hell of a lot more crime?. Just because its not the same here doesn`t mean we are wrong?.
The only people that are out of step are those like the lady who just got caught, maybe she should have researched Guernsey`s tough laws on drug smugglers first eh.
What they do in Saudi to those women in my eyes is nothing less than murder.
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…I’ve never done anything illegal!
Anyway, we’re entitled to our opinions as you are yours.
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Wow. A lot to take in there! As a girl from Manchester myself, who lives in Guernsey in a respectful and law-abiding way, I can’t believe some of the posts here. This girls ‘friends and family’ (if they are for real!) are giving us a bad name. I am shocked that my fellow Northeners can be so illiterate, ridiculous and completely oblivious to the laws of the land.
Here’s a point. If you have children and it is nearly Christmas and you are broke, you have choices. Do not smuggle drugs into our lovely island where we moved to in order to bring our own children up well. Here is another option that most of you would not have considered – turn off Jeremy Kyle and GET A JOB!!!!!!!!!
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Can I just ask where all of you so called friends of this woman are from? Do you live in Guernsey or are you from England?
If you are from England then my advice to you all is, do not follow her example or you will follow her to jail.
If you are from Guernsey it seems strange that you are all so concerned about her getting locked up, has your supply been brought to an abrupt end?
If you are from Guernsey then I hope that someone from The Education department is looking in and makes some recommendations to the schools to start teaching proper English language to the pupils.
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By the way, the woman did wrong, she is doing her time and her daughter is in safe hands until she returns hopefully having learnt a lesson.
Just one more point, if you “friends” were aware of her predicament with owing such money then why didn`t you help her to find a resolution for her problems. There are organisations for free advice such as The Citizen`s Advice Bureau, The Salvation Army etc.
Oh, and believe it or not the police will point you in the right direction especially if you give them information on the drug dealer who offered you the job of being a “mule”.
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If the posts from the UK ‘friend’ contingent are an example of what cannabis can do to your intelligence level long may this islands strong stance against drug runners continue.
@Lorre
Importation of cannabis into Guernsey is illegal and therefore a crime in the real world. Your world is obviously a bit foggy. you cannot have a crime that’s ‘not a real crime’. It either is or it isn’t. drug running is. Sorry to be the bearer of reality.
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@Jane Devenport
yawn
Why defend someone who has broke the law? People like you are soooo boring.
Well done Guernsey customs keeping our streets clean and maybe one day people who are not from these shores will get the message we do not tolerate their ways.
Bring back the birch
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Kelly is as a matter of fact.A political prisoner.
Under European law.
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@lorre
Do you know what that means? It means that you are suggesting that Kelly was imprisioned due to her participation in political activity. Er…what activity would that have been exactly? Was she campaigning? no. She was smuggling.
You’re talking rubbish, you should just give up now.
Anyhoo it doesn’t really matter, it’s Guernsey law that governs these shores. So UK law, European Law (?), EU regs…you can say them all till you’re blue in the face! They don’t matter.
She did wrong, she’s now paying the price. She’ll most likely get her kid back when she comes out.
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Why do people continue to feed the trolls??
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I am getting more and more convinced that lorre is none other than that total prat PB Falla in disguise
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Personally I think adultery causes much more hurt and harm in society than smoking a joint.
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@ Lorre
Kelly, a political prisoner! What are you talking about?
She is a common drug dealer who got caught and is paying the consequences.
She didnt think about the havoc and pain her drugs would cause on the streets of Guernsey.
Lorre I do not know where you live. Are you among her Salford friends? if drugs are common and every day in Salfoed then I am sorry for you but it does not make it acceptable. Perhaps you should be putting your energy into campaiging against drugs.
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Phil – with all due respect we’re not debating that…
Legilisation of cannibus may be a valid debate, however, currently it’s illegal. Therefore she is not innocent and is not a political prisoner. In fact that’s just so random I’m not sure where it came from!
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Well that’s an hour of my life I wont’t get back, but thanks for the laughs!!
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What this story does show is the need for a far more imaginative sentencing system in Guernsey. We should give our Border Agency the ability to plea bargain with people like Kelly. They should be given the legal authority to say “right, you’re facing a two or three year custodial sentence for this but if you give us the names of the real villains – the people you;re working for – and you’re willing to testify in court against them you are GUARANTEED a suspended non-custodial sentence.”
Think what sort of deterrent that would be for the ‘drugs barons’ like Curtis in Jersey who target the Channel Islands. Any takers?’
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I guess what Lorre is some what incoherantly saying is – that instead of being given a caution and or ‘on the spot fine’ as Miss Davenport would have recieved if arriving into say Gatwick airport, she was arrested and seperated from her child. Then she was held in prison with out trial for 4 months. During the court case the value of the cannabis was over inflated. Her guilt or innocence was not determined by a common jury of her peer’s, like in the UK. The sentence she recieved is significantly harsher than those given by our European nieghbours. Finaly our Bailiff is both head of the states and head of the courts, which many think is concidered not compliant with Human Rights legistation.
Whilst Guernsey does things differently to other places, it cannot always be said we do things fairer or better or cheaper. I imagine the whole financial cost of the affair to the tax payer has been huge, with court costs, advocates fee’s and the massive cost of imprisonment.
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Lorre – you are sooo funny! Every post is making me laugh in utter disbelief at your ignorance and total disregard for acutal facts! brilliant.
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matt
The Bailiff is nothing more than a referee in the States. He does not take decisions or set policy. He has no vote. “Many” may think that it is not Human Rights compliant but, crucially, the ECHR is not one of them.
A common jury in a close community like Guernsey would be a recipe for unfairness, bias and miscarriages of justice (mostly in people being acquitted because they are known to be a “good sort”, or they are a cousin of a neighbour’s sister). The jurat system works perfectly well. Are you really suggesting that she did not get a fair trial? She was found with the weed in her bra – how could a jury of “common peers” determine that to be anything other than guilt?? Did she even plead not guilty?
If the value of the cannabis was relevant to the trial and was “over-inflated” (what is the correct level of inflation by the way?) then her Advocate could have easily countered the evidence as to its value.
It seems to me that you don’t like rigorous punishment for smuggling cannabis and are scraping the barrel for reasons why our system is wrong compared to our more lax neighbours.
I say, look at the results. If a harsh drug policy is not working then by all means relax it or change it to make it more effective and targeted. But I think that our drug policy seems to be working pretty well, thanks.
The cost of law enforcement might be large, but surely if something is illegal then the law should be enforced, not waived merely because it is too expensive? Your priorities seem to be a bit mixed up.
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Martino – Perhaps I’ve watched too many gangster movies but my one nagging concern with your idea is that people who shop in drugs barons could well be putting themselves (or even their families) in danger. They may well consider a couple of years in prison a better option.
Any such measures would at the least need to include some kind of effective witness protection.
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Small island Small Minds
says it all
Another guernsey shambles
Rule Britannia
God Bless her
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Ofcourse Kelly is a political prisoner and the judge is the criminal.
Am amazed by the amout/numbskuls posting on here who are unaware of that.
She did no wrong. Full stop.
No crime so no time eh?
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Guernsey law system
Child porn images, 15 months in prison
500 gsm of cannabis resin, 30 months in prison.
Which is the worst crime???
For gods sake guernsey, wake the hell up!!!
And its resin which usually contains around 10% of plant.
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Scarlett, you are a genius. Couldn’t have put it better myself. What is this strange language they are speaking with numbers in words and the letter ‘v’ where a ‘th’ should be? Unbelievable. May I suggest you all apply to go on The Jeremy Kyle Show then I can look forward to watching you make fools of yourselves next time I am off work sick. Yes, I work… there’s a new concept for you.
As for the lunatic who suggested the Guernsey courts sent John Louis Symphorien to an early grave, might I suggest the 10-litre-a-week whiskey habit might have had something to do with it? Just a thought.
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Lorre
I know you’re a troll but I’ll hamper to you for now.
So she didn’t break any Guernsey laws?
She didn’t admit her guilt?
Why is she a political prisoner?
Was the judge not following Guernsey laws?
…
Meh, probably wasting my time…
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Lorre – Please would you be so kind as to clarify why Kelly is a political prisoner and why you consider the judge to be a criminal? If we are all “numbskuls” [sic], the please take is as your responsibility to educate us.
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If you want to support a REAL political prisoner, who is being tortured by a western government as you read this post, please check out the website below
http://www.avaaz.org/en/bradley_manning
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Martino, the Curtis Warren case in Jersey is a disgrace. I sincerely hope our police never act like they did in Jersey. Lorre (the troll) should actually be championing his cause.
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Well done Jersey Police
You managed to get the job done by freeing at least one of the two hands tied behind your back
Awaiting the judgement on Curtis’ claim that his human rights (to import £1M worth of poison into Jersey)were not honoured ! Bang him up for life
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@JJ
Whether or not he was caught by dodgy means (and I’m not saying it’s right if he was), there is no doubt that Warren is the sort of big player that the likes of Kelly act as mules for. I was just giving his name as an example and I still think plea bargaining for couriers (which wouldn’t have applied in the Warren case) is worth looking at.
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well i think people csittizising her for takeing her daughter with her need to think she must av had very bad reasons to take err daughter doing wat she done two week before christmas
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tracydwyer
Your right, it was a very bad reason that she took her daughter with her. It was most likely to arrouse less suspicion as she went through customs.
She was being used as a tool in her smuggling operation? that went wrong.
I can understand why somone who is desperate doing things they should`nt when they feel there is no other way but bringing a kid into it beggers belief.
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Awwwww poor Kelly i really want u to get out of prison even know u but I know ur neice teigan she misses u too swell as all these people putting cOmments and ur Toni misses u and so does jenine hurry get out of that stupid prison haha
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Every parent has choices, even ones living in poverty. To get pressies for your kids at Christmas one does not need to resort to crime. That was her choice to do so.
She could have chosen to ask for help from the hundreds of social charities whose very existence is to provide help for low income families in times of need. There are no shortage of clothing banks to provide clothes and shoes.
This woman chose to commit a crime, she chose to involve her daughter in it and she chose to risk being separated from her daughter if she got caught, which she was.
We all have choices.
However it has been very entertaining reading the awful (almost indecipherable) posts by the friends and family of this woman. It is just like watching the Jeremy Kyle show. Thanks.
Oh and for the person who blamed Tony Blair for the illiteracy of these folk, rubbish. My son went to a UK primary school and did just fine. It’s not just about blaming other people, or the Government, or anyone else but yourself. Like I say, we all have choices.
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stop saying stuff about my mother and liltle sis ok. cause if my mum hears about this.
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Congratulations jaden kelly son. By far the most articulate of the kelly clan posting on this thread. Now if your mother is 28 you can’t be much older than 12 so why is it that leanne, tracy, louise and the others seem incapable of stringing a few words together in decent English?
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I’m still waiting for Lorre to educate us all please.
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Why can’t you all just leave her alone now she’s doing her time no point keep slagging her off, no matter what she’s done she is a nice girl one of the best.
And as for us salfordians not speaking proper english, you locals must be living in the dark ages if you don’t understand text writing, at the end of the day if P.As can use shorthand whats wrong with us salfordians using text writing.
NOW END OF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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salford ghetto – this thread had gone to sleep nicely until you woke it up again, therefore “END OF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!” [sic] had occured already.
1. This is a public forum and people are entitled to express opinions, both ways, and to argue with one another.
2. This is a public forum and as such it is helpful if posters use standard English as opposed to “txt spk” and “grammar-less” prose, so that we can all understand one another. PAs use shorthand for themselves, they don’t expect anyone else to be able to read it.
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Hayley its obvious that this thread has not gone to sleep,because you yourself are still checking it for comments.I’m not saying people aren’t entitled to express their own opinions, but being ignorant to the way people are writing their opinions down doesn’t make use any better than us salfordians.
It’s not my fault you islanders haven’t got the knack for reading text speak, so give up being snotty and let people say want they feel instead of having a go at their grammar!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Hayley is right.Threads tend to drop lower down the pecking order until they finally disappear through lack of interest or further comment
Rather disturbing to note however that the thread concerning the Chief Minister and his work with / for the Concept group has dropped off the radar because no further comments were permitted
As far as I am concerned that story should run and run right up to the next election
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I thought this was supose to be a discusion board for people to view there opions about what has happened but its more of a slanging match of how people speak. well done salford ghetto for sticking up for all people who speak differntly. Shame on you hayley, for someone who thinks they speak proper grammer need to take lessons in how not to be ignorent towards others. NOW END OF !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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salford ghetto
I don’t watch specific threads, I just look at the “your shout” link and take note of which threads are being posted on and what people have to say, therefore, by posting you brought this one right back to the top.
salfords maddog
It is not too much to ask for standard English to be used on a public forum. There wouldn’t be much point in me posting in a foreign language on here as people would not understand what I am trying to say, same applies to txt spk.
I am not suggesting that my grammar or spelling are perfect, but at least most people seem to understand what I write.
Anyway, I have now gone totally off topic for which I apologise, but I felt the need to reply to the “Salford Crew”.
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