Industry concerns as Jersey looks at raising age for drinking alcohol
Friday 22nd July 2011, 2:29PM BST.
RAISING the legal drinking age in Guernsey could cause problems across the board, according to people in the trade.
The States of Jersey is looking at raising the limit in a bid to tackle under-age drinking.
Drug and Alcohol Strategy co-ordinator Andrea Nightingale (picutred) said she would keep an open mind on the subject, but said it could have huge implications for pubs and off-licence premises.
‘We would certainly be very interested in Jersey’s findings as to whether raising the age to 21 would have a positive effect on the community,’ she said.
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What a backwards idea.
This would just lead to more underage drinkers. Its not right to penalise an age group of people that on the whole have been drinking responsibly to deter others.
If you really want to tackle the problem you should be educating kids about the issue at school & encouranging parents to talk about the issue with them so they use it responsibly and know the dangers. Binge drinking is the bigger issue.
Also you should make sure ID’s are being requested and checked properly. That way children can only have access to alcohol at home. (Mind you having been young I know if they really want it they will get their hands on it.)
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If we raised the limit to 21 let’s look at what we’re actually saying. We are telling young adults they are mature enough to legally…
- fight and die for their country (18)
- drive a car (17)
- get married (16 w/parental consent, 18 without)
- have sex – and therefore children (16)
- buy tobacco (18)
…but not to buy an alcoholic drink.
As far as I’m concerned the only debate we need is to decide on a consistent legal “universal age of adulthood” where all adult activities are legal.
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People can be irresponsible with alcohol whatever age they are, regardless of what the limit is. And if people are already drinking when they are under the age limit, raising the age limit isn’t going to make them think twice and not do it anymore.
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Paul Le P
Raises a good point, there should be one legal age for everything, probably 18 is about right, at the moment as Paul points out it is a mess with several age levels for different things. We have lowered the age for voting and consensual sex between same sex partners which has really helped the over all confusion but the rights of those two examples were correct we just need to tidy up the rest. Raising the age of alcohol consumption would in my view be penalising all of the hundreds of other 18 year olds who behave quite properly when drinking. Most of those who do get a little the worse for wear just as many of us did when we were younger are good humoured youngsters enjoying there carefree years and the vast majority make it home without to many problems. For those who become a nuisance, cause criminal damage or assault people, then it is up to the courts to ensure they don’t do it twice. We have in my view become far to willing to interfere in the lives of our people for no good reason and as we become more overcrowded, we become less tolerant, whether it is kids playing in the street, youngsters in their cars in the evenings at the North beach or music festivals with periodic noise.
We are told that raising the drinking age could “have a positive effect on the community” well we could bring in all kinds of laws that would curtail the rights and freedoms of people to do almost anything which might “have a positive effect on the community” but you may as well live in a totalitarian state if we go down that route. I think 18 is fine as it is and lets crack down on those who abuse our community and other members of the public when they are out for the night and leave everybody else alone.
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It will not solve any problems, it will just increase the number of underage drinkers, and make policing the law even harder.
Paul, I don’t agree with your comparison about what you can do at a younger age, as you are not normally going to be abusive, physically sick, or start a fight doing any of what you have listed, whereas more often than not a ‘tanked’ up youngster on a Friday night will more than likely do one of the above through drink. If young adults were mature enough the topic would not of made the headlines, although I agree with your comment of a universal age for adulthood when all activities become legal.
Parents need to take more responsibilty for their childrens actions, and even be penalised, heavy fines or similar for parents might make them think twice about ‘patting’ their son on the back for having a scrap or being plastered in public!!
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Alcohol in moderation is probably OK at any age .. the French seem to wean their young children gently into the habit responsibly and without too many problems
The problem in Guernsey is often caused by the people who sell the stuff and continue to sell the stuff until the customer either runs out of money or runs out of time
Take for example the recent most unfortunate case of the man who died in Park Lane trying to fish his lost keys out of a deep drain
The report of the inquest stated that his friends decided to leave him in a drunken heap in the lane after closing time as it ‘often happened’
Apparently he had been out drinking since noon and visited several pubs until closing time.Did the Police investigating this very sad death enquire of his friends what time they believed he became drunk,and which licensed premises continued to serve him alcohol after he became drunk?
I very much doubt that it was the very last drink at the very last pub he visited which tipped him over the edge so perhaps a few licensees might be offering good advice to their bar staff right now?
I very much doubt it though
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Absolutely crazy
Yet another example of the States Interfering in the private lives of ordinary people, how dare they assume that all all under 21′s are out of control, the majority are sensible, ok sometimes high spirits (no pun intended) mean they get a little rowdy now and then but wern’t all the states members young once ? or were they all born middle aged.
Let the ‘other island’ get on with it, but don’t treat our youngsters like they cannot think for themselves.
By the way I am 57 years old !
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So if Jersey goes ahead and raises the drinking age, and Guernsey doesn’t, look at all the extra business Guernsey establishments will get from the Jersey 18+ teens doing a “Guernsey Weekend Bash”!
Guernsey will need to have extra manpower for those occasions!
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Donkey Abroad
I don’t understand why you dismiss my comparisons because of the consequences of irresponsibly drinking EXCESSIVE alcohol. What about the other consequences? Take driving – wouldn’t you agree that it is equally dangerous at 17 to trust someone behind the wheel of a car, which if driven recklessly can kill?
You say “If young adults were mature enough the topic would not of made the headlines”; I say irresponsibility occurs across the entire age spectrum, it is not limited to young adults….or are you suggesting that once we all reach 21 we’re all nicely balanced members of society?
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They should also look at Canada’s and America’s Minor In Possession laws. Anybody in possession of any amount of booze underage the booze is confiscated and the underage person taken to the police station for their parents to come collect and explain why the kid had the booze in the first place.
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I like alcohol, i dont think age should be a barrier, Shaun got his gold card for Folie’s at 18.
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Lets take this into account, they want to increase the age to 21, now lets think this through, already with the age limit at 18 a huge amount of under-age drinking is apparent? correct? i have been there and done it myself, nearly everyone does/has at that age! With the age limit set to increase, alot more underage drinking will take place, as the now ‘underage’ 18-20 year olds will struggle to find something to do on a weekend, or even during the week, with little or nothing to do on this island at this age, as the cinema is not really ideal, and no decent places that hold entertainment are available therefore alot more underage drinking will occur. I believe alot more crime will also occur, in terms of street crime, as many people will be unable to entertain themselves and therefore will result in crime inorder to seek entertainment. I believe that a system like in Geneva, where to buy it is 16 for beer and cider, but 18 for spirits and the rest, should be adopted, however maybe not at 16 and 18, maybe 18 and 20? or 18 and 19. Alike alot of the comments said above, which are true to their word, it is wrong to punish the entire age group for the acts of individuals rather than that of the entire group. Not also will this punish the age population, but also the economy, and business’ that are dependant upon the sale of alcohol, as for example clubs and bars, will have a fairly large amount of their customers turned away, and they will therefore lose business, which is vital to them, every little helps! I personally enjoy town at the age of 18, and more so enjoy having a pint at the end of the week at the pub, or watching the footy on the tv at the pub with a few mates, as it gives us the chance to socialise and enjoy ourselves. Dont take these opportunites away from us/them! I believe this idea is disgraceful and should not be put forward!
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This would be a stupid idea, most places it’s 18 and the places which it is 21 i.e. the US is because they have had it like that for ages i have not heard of any place in recent years to go from 18-21.
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Raising the age for drinking to 21 is not going to do much to stop the culture of binge drinking in Guernsey or Jersey. It may make it more difficult for the average child to get served; but that won’t interfere with drinking at home, before then going out to meet friends. This whole story is a massive sideshow to the social disgrace that is the drink-fuelled violence and disorder that we see in Town and elsewhere every weekend. As a result, some parts of Town are now virtual “no go zones” due to the unpleasant behaviour of many.
We need to focus on precisely why so many people in our community (not just the younger elements of our island) abuse alcohol so significantly, week in, week out. Binge drinking not only very often leads to anti-social behaviour and crime; it also leads to great costs to the economy, with lost days at work through hangovers and more serious health problems. These issues cannot be allowed to get worse.
It’s all very well for people to say “keep the limit at 18 and have more education etc” but the reality is that the education programmes introduced to date have simply not succeeded in encouraging a more grown up approach to drinking. Peer pressure seems to undermine all of “sensible drinking” education. Some very serious analysis is required to look at the cultural origins of binge drinking in this island. It cannot purely be about boredom. That analysis then should be used to help inform new programmes of education against over-drinking.
All I know is that increasing the drinking age limit will do little or nothing to deal with the major issue here; the issue of binge drinking and its associated problems.
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I thought the Crapauds were daft this proves it raising the age limit will cause more underage drinking.
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Does 1 age for everything deliver it “all at once” and it becomes to much. I do think we should actually be lowering the ages. At least if they are allowed in pubs a lot of it is off the streets. And “can be contained”
Why is it allways the “ban it” or “raise the age limit” people who think this actually works. All you are doing is trying to stop people growing up. Surely we want people to “grow up” not keep them as kids in adults bodies.
The old ways are not working, for goodness sake tring something radical for a change.
And yes I am aware that if ages where lowered in the immediate short term the problem would probably increase. But I believe the long term effects wpould be better.
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This will not take place, stop discussing the topic.
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As many people have stated, raising the age limit will do nothing to stop underage drinking. Lowering the limit would however. Not that its a good idea.
There should however be stricter controls on who can get served/drink in bars and clubs.
In the US it is quite common to be asked for IS as you enter a pub (i’m quite a few years over 21 and have had to car my Passport last time i was out over there. Quite often you are given a coloured arm band indicating if you are over 21 or not. That way people under 21 can still go to pub but are fairly easy to spot if they are drinking.
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This is ridiculous. Given that a lot of people in town on a Saturday night aren’t even 18 anyway, raising the age to 21 will do very little.
I would say a good amount of the trouble I see in town involves people over 21 anyway. Does this mean we should then raise the drinking age to 25? I think not.
I understand that the majority of trouble is most likely caused by the younger age group but is this really going to solve anything, or just infuriate the very group of hot-headed people that are causing the problems?
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I’m 20, and for the past two years since I finished school, the best and most convenient way for me to keep in contact and socialise with my friends, is over a few drinks in the pub of a weekend. Yeah, sometimes some people take it too far (we’ve all drank too much at some point, either inadvertendly or otherwise), but the point is, none of us have ever caused trouble, the only time we’ve been kicked out of a pub/club is when it’s closing time. And it stops us from losing contact with each other, as other than weather dependant activities (i.e. beach, a kick about in the park etc) are not always possible, particularly in the winter, and there’s very rarely a chance to use a friend’s house to meet up. I’d be willing to bet that alot of the revenue gained by many of these establishments, is from 18-20 year olds buying alcoholic drinks. So all we’ll see, is more underage drinking, pubs and clubs either closing down or charging more, less tax money from alcohol sales going down… And ultimately the sensible guys like us who have never caused trouble, drink sensibly 99% of the time and are just out to have fun, will be the ones who get penilised, while the less sensible ones will just subvert it by having fake I.D’s, or getting trashed at pre-drinks at someones house, before causing trouble when Barbados won’t let them in…
We need to tackle the culture in the long term, not avoid the subject in the short…
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I said that if i had money, i would invest in a young peoples pub….what?? yes, a pub for young people that is alcohol free but has the trappings of a pub atmosphere with the pool tables, the juke box a live band on a weekend. Young people have youth clubs but for the young people aged 16 – 18 having their own pub, especially at weekends i know that many of them would go and enjoy it and not even look to drink alcohol but would enjoy having cocktails or something like it, even if its alcohol free. Just the pub atmosphere would be enough for most of them.
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kim
| July 25, 2011 at 11:17 pm
I said that if i had money, i would invest in a young peoples pub….what?? yes, a pub for young people that is alcohol free
Wow, I agree entirely Kim, and I am in my 40s. In my day youth club was a disco on a Friday night, a small taster of the adult world. Now youth clubs are sanitised with full bright lighting, hardly giving the kids a taste of adult life is it.
Let our kids grow up for goodness sake.
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This is madness,
You wish to raise the drinking age to 21, then people will do what most teenagers under 18 do, which is attempt to get served underage or get somebody to purchase it for them, and then go and drink in a park or somewhere similiar.
At least if people are drinking in town then usually the Police are they to police the area and bars and Clubs should be responsible enough to turn somebody away when they are too drunk.
this is surly got to be better the drinking in the corner of some park or on an estate for example.
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On a similar note, I have always opposed the likes of Barbados and Folies raising the age of entrance to 21 for males. I feel that the 90% of males between 18-21 who are just out to have a nice, fun and trouble-free night are being punished for the acts of a small minority that a stronger bouncer / police force would have sorted out years ago.
I am DEEPLY opposed to the drinking age going up to 21 because it will negatively affect almost all of the clubs/bars in St Peter Port because they will lose a lot of business and of course, everyone within that age band will find a way around it anyway, whether it being house parties or even fake I.Ds. House parties have always been more serious in the eyes of police anyway because more often than not they get out of control and unlike town, there is no supervision by means of police or security. Problem Police?
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Just because most 18-20 year old can drink sensibly, doesn’t mean all can. There s alot of general drunken anti social behaviour around town. Alcohol is bad for peoples health, and is the root cause of drink driving.
We should show the way forward and act before Jersey and impliment a ban.
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I think the legal age could even be dropped to 16. I remember going to sark when i was “ahem” 15 – with mates, got so drunk and hungover that it completely put me off drinking, had the same effect with some off my friends too. It was like a short phase that i went through that by the time i was 17 and had a car my drinking days were over. I am still freinds with my school mates and into adulthood i dont have a single freind that drinks very often.
What im saying (and no doubt it may sound daft) is that the younger kids start drinking the quicker they stop and move on with the next stage of life. Or so my theory goes anyway!
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Im for a ban to the age of 25
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pbfalla
were you for a ban until the age of 25 when you were 18?
foreigner you want to look at the u.s.a. as an example of how to control crime? mmmm…..
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Kevin
Yes
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“The Trade” people only have themselves to blame for this increase in the age limit to be discussed, if they stopped selling to underage (as it is now) people and encouraging drunkenness and bad behaviour then it wouldn`t need to be discussed.
Look in your own backyards and at your own morals first.
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Matt,
I have never heard or read such a stupidly obvious statement as your “Alcohol is bad for peoples health, and is the root cause of drink driving.”
Of course it`s the root cause of drink driving, that`s wht it`s called DRINK driving. Do think it is caused by eating sweet and sour pork?
With statements like that you must the Matt that is a States Deputy.
If you are the deputy then with statements of that strength of clarity you could well oust Deputy Trott as head of the Guernsey Reich.
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Matt – your comments are way too generalised.
To begin with, although excessive drinking is most certainly bad for health, a certain amount of alcohol is actually considered beneficial.
Then there is the issue of anti social behaviour. Certainly you have a point however it is not just those under 21 involved. Take a look at the GP and you’ll see people of all ages being convicted of alcohol related offences.
If we take your reasoning then we shouldn’t be looking at raising the drinking age to 21, but investigating prohibition.
We need to be clear on this. The issue is not with alcohol users, it’s with alcohol abusers – and those two letters make a huge difference.
What is being suggested here punishes the first category for the actions of the second, and will do nothing to stop it.
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