Aurigny will evaluate jets when it replaces ATR
Wednesday 13th March 2013, 5:00PM GMT.
AURIGNY could operate jets in the future, it confirmed.
Flybe is reintroducing a jet service on the Guernsey-Gatwick route at the end of the month and Aurigny commercial director Malcolm Coupar, pictured, said it had not ruled out doing the same.
‘We are evaluating different aircraft types, including jets, and will provide further information when it is available,’ he said.
‘Our oldest ATR, “DB”, which is leased, is due to be handed back to its owner early in 2014. More details of its replacement will be made in due course.’
Flybe has been operating its fleet of Embraer 175s on other routes for more than a year.
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Go for it Aurigny with sensible ticket costs. Then swing by Jersey to collect a few of us. Flybe is not popular and has been ripping us off for years.
Share price Flybe .47pence , Easyjet £10.67. Says it all really, can’t be just Jersey.
Davey.
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There wont be any picking up from Jersey. Only Trislanders do that as the short flight is harsh on the engines and expensive. Ticket prices won’t go down even if an aircraft was ‘gifted’ LOL
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Surely the headline should have read:
“Aurigny management to railroad States of Guernsey to committing millions of pounds of taxpayers money on totally unnecessary gimmick using standard Smoke and Mirrors procedure”
That’s pretty much the size of it, if this is a “they’ve got one, we want one” I don’t know what is…..
We find ourselves in probably unpredecedented times of austerity the likes of which we’ve not seen in generations, but again, under the radar, Aurigny will probably manage to have the States of Guernsey commit themselves to massive capital expenditure to satisfy the whims of a few.
The reality of this proposition is quite frankly ridiculous, the ecomonics of operating a jet aircraft over the typical sector lengths that this Airline flies make absolutely no sense whatsoever, however, “we must have it” I’m sure will be the call?
I’m sure that Blue Islands would love one too, however, economics, not taypayers money dictate the sense in a proposal, not an over inflated ego which is sadly what generally drives Aurigny.
So where’s the compromise then, shall we just close a school or maybe a hospital ward to buy them a jet which when pitched on a 40 minute sector against an ATR loses hands down?
I dare say they will, however, don’t expect me to pay 30% in the pound to finance this, sadly this Island is losing sense of reality…
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good post …Mr Taxpayer
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If it means that they will start doing direct flights to Europe then I’m all for it.
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Didn’t Flybe already say there would be no change to prices nor would they be quicker?
In which case surely the only sensible justification to spend this kind of money would be saving on fuel/Co2 emissions and even then I imagine it would take a long time for that saving to cover the initial capital…
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As my username suggests, I do hope this is just Press hype.
Aurigny already operate by today’s standards modern aircraft in their two ATR 72-500′s which I believe the States stood guarantor for the loan to purchase them.
I also hope that they at most would just be evaluating A jet to replace the older ATR referenced in the above article.
However in today’s economic times with sky high fuel prices, it would make absolutely no sense to operate a jet in terms of fuel burn which I would in visage to be possibly at least 2x that of the ATR. Particularly when Aurigny are not making money as it is.
The only side of the argument which I may agree with would be that they may feel they need a jet to remain competitive with flybe once they begin to operate their Embraer 175′s on the guernsey – gatwick. And just to clarify by competitive I mean in terms of customers preferring jet travel over props.
I await further news but Mr taxpayer I agree.
If aurigny was profitable I’d also have less of an issue however it makes no sense for year on year loss making outfit to be upgrading their aircraft from perhaps the most fuel efficient turboprop in the world to fuel guzzling jet.
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In terms of time, jets can fly faster but the reason that there will be at most just 5-10mins difference is that when the aircraft arrives in the vicinity of the airport, particularly busy airspace like gatwick, it has to follow certain procedures under speed control much of the time, whether its a dash 8 or 747.
And in terms of fuel burn there is absolutely no way that the Embraer is more fuel efficient than the ATR.
I agree with Mr tax payer.
Perhaps when Aurigny demonstrates that it can make a profit for a couple of years running then running a ‘prestigious’ jet service maybe an option.
However it would make no sense to give a loss making airline the tools to lose more money and especially with the poor tax payer footing the bill.
If you can’t make money with ATR’s on the sector lengths that are flown by from guernsey then there are other issues at bay rather than the issues that can be rectified by changing aircraft.
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While it appears to make little economic (or environmental) sense on paper, the reality is that outside of Guernsey, FlyBe is a much better known airline and those travelling from the UK are far more likely to pick them. In addition, the general perception is that jets are more reliable and quicker, whether or not, over such a relatively short distance, it makes any material difference to the flight time.
Also, those who aren’t accustomed to flying on turboprops (again, most likely to be those travelling from the UK) may find additional comfort travelling in a type of aircraft they are more familiar with. The exact model of aircraft isn’t important, but the fact that it looks like a “proper” plane to the average passenger means they’ll go with what they know. The average Guernsey person may get a slight twinge of seeing a slice of home when they spot the puffin on the tailfin at Gatwick but the UK traveller on a FlyBe Embraer will probably feel rather relieved they are on something a bit bigger.
While I’d rather be proved wrong, my feeling is that FlyBe are probably quite sensible going for the jet option as it gives them a considerable perception advantage to Aurigny. Even those more used to travelling by turboprops are likely to look on a delayed ATR 72 and imagine it’s due to them being an “old” technology and reconsider about using FlyBe for the perception that they might be more reliable as their equipment seems more modern.
Of course the one issue that nobody has noted is how all those living close to the airport will feel about the much louder jet take off disturbing them at 7.00 each morning.
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@Cousin vinny!!
I have been an ATR engineer for nearly 4 years now. And have recently recieved my Embraer Engineering Qualification. I can for certain say that an Embraer jet being very much modern compared to an ATR, burns up to 25% less fuel on short haul then an ATR. As for long haul, that explains itself.
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That’s the funniest thing I’ve ever read!
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-500 (which Aurigny has) and -600 variants are more efficient than the Embraer 175s on domestic sectors. There’s a reason turboprops came back into fashion following the rise in commodity prices – they’re very efficient.
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You must be kidding?
If you can provide a link to back that up I’d be amazed.
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Aurigny said “evaluating” jets as a possible replacement for a turboprop due to leave the fleet. It is entirely sensible to be doing an evaluation of the most viable alternatives when aquiring a multi million pound asset, and if nothing else the evaluation will give them a feel for what it is costing flybe to operate their jet.
What none of the commentators here appear to have considered is that Gatwick Airport have publicly declared an objective of clearing their runway of small aircraft. The way they are doing this is by charging small aircraft the same landing fees as large aircraft. Therefore the undoubted benefits of operating ATR aircraft on Gatwick services (fuel efficiency) are rapidly being eroded.
The States bought Aurigny to insure the community against losing services to Gatwick, so Aurigny is obliged to leave no stone unturned in finding the best way of providing these services in future. If Gatwick keep raising the landing fees (and they say they will) there may well come a time when the cost per passenger for these, exceeds the fuel cost per passenger on a larger jet, then the ATR economics will be the poorer. So far from making “absolutely no sense whatsoever” it may make perfectly good sense.
As for Blue Islands, if they wanted a jet they would just go and get one. To suggest they do things based on sound economic arguements (rather than Aurigny’s “over inflated ego”!) is to suggest that they are a profitable organisation! Even they themselves don’t make claims like that.
Just a thought:
If Blue Islands shut down tomorrow, Aurigny would in all likelyhood become profitable, saving the taxpayers money. Healthspan could then channel those funds that are presently being poured into the Blue Islands black hole into funding a “Healthspan” school or hospital ward.
I’m sure that public would greatly appreciate that, Healthspan’s profile (or its owner’s) would be restored and respected, and we’d all be happy.
Now all we need is somebody with a big enough ego to make it all happen……….
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Fair points regarding gatwick and the slots.
Just been reading the channel island business magazine latest edition. There is an article in there regarding blueislands and it goes on to say that a profit is expected for this year. Just goes to show, it can be done.
Healthspan providing schools? Why should they, we already have a couple of private schools on the island. The states provide the rest of the education….oh wait..
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Blue Islands say every year that they’ll be profitable this year or next year, but they’ve never actually achieved it in their 10+ years.
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More wishy washy reporting once again by the Press I am afraid to say.
“Taxpayer” raised some very good points but it seems to me that Mr Malcolm Coupar is only stating the obvious by stating that Aurigny has not ruled out using jets in the future.
They have not ruled them out.
Means simply that and not that they are going to start Embraer jet services at a definite point of time in the future.
Common sense will prevail.
We hope.
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@Mr Taxpayer, Austerity in Guernsey, really?
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Well, on the whole some really good, subjective posts here and generally devoid of the typical “Aurigny nostalgia” that seems to fuel so many others!
However, Errmmmm, trust me, austerity in Guernsey, you’ve seen nothing yet, just watch this space my friend. Jersey was pretty much the same, a “head in the clouds, nothing can get us” attitude, very different now. Unemployment at record levels, a housing market in a shocking state, don’t ever think it can’t happen here, it can….
ATR Tech, respect entirely your comments however, the practicalities of fixing them vastly different to the economics of flying them and over a typical sector length as flown by Aurigny an EMB170 cannot touch an ATR72 regardless of published SFC.
To make a jet work ideally you’ll be looking for somewhere in the order of 1.30 hours in the air minimum, get it up high and then enjoy those fuel savings, trash it up to maybe 18,000 feet on the way to Gatwick, sit in cruise for 20 mins and then come back down, your ATR will have burnt probably 500 litres less…
Some of the posters have hit the nail on the head here “public perception” and especially here in Guernsey where generally people do not have the opportunity to fly on a Jet, it’ll be be something to try!
However, Flybe can mix the aircraft on other routes across the network, it may not be ideal on the Gatwick, however, it’ll be doing lots of other longer sectors over a month whcih makes it potentially more viable.
Why don’t we do this the fairest way, a public referendum? Those who think that it’s such a brilliant idea, then you pay for it with increased taxes and enjoy it, others like me who think the whole thing cobblers will not pay a penny towards it but promise never to fly on it!
I just want to see my money that I contribute towards this Island used in a sensible manner, not again frittered away in some madcap scheme which makes no sense. Goodness me, when you think just how long we waited for an MRI scanner at the PEH and the good that it has done to date, then reflect on the capital costs of a scheme like this, you’d buy three scanners for the price of one aircraft, just insane……
However, as said, “they’ve got one, I want one”……….
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One point that no one has mentioned is the fact the existing ATR-72-200 needs replacing within a matter of months so a new aircraft will be required. One shouldn’t been looking at the cost of an EMB175 but the cost difference between an ATR and an EMB175.
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I love Embraers! Im a business man, and i’ve flown out of London City with British Airways on their Emb195 and i can honestly say its my favourite short-haul aircraft around today!
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