Difficult, but answers are needed
Saturday 22nd October 2011, 2:30PM BST.
A LETTER published on this page a couple of days ago took the newspaper to task over our coverage of the Education Department’s handling of the high schools’ GCSE exam results, saying that events needed to be reported in a neutral and balanced manner with no outside interest and with minimal harm to the people involved.
The recent articles and, particularly, the editorial comments in this column indicated a newspaper shamefully intent on the reverse, it suggested.
The correspondence is a good example of the difficulties faced in dealing with significant topics, especially where there is a reluctance by officials to release or discuss all the relevant information, and where the factual news report is later subject to editorial comment.
And while the reporting strives to be impartial, it will of necessity follow an angle where, say, a department is withholding information for no good purpose.
Editorial comment in that case is unlikely to be favourable. In the example of Education, shortly before it was forced to release school exam performance, its director of education was writing to this newspaper saying that ‘…the conclusion from the graph that results have declined is simply wrong’. Really?
There are, to put it mildly, issues of credibility involved. Is it a witch-hunt to seek to get to the bottom of that? Similarly with the earlier-raised concerns about the management style of the department. Is it blame-seeking or sensible to ask what the current political board has done to address the issues raised in an employment and discrimination tribunal report and a subsequent Education Department review?
Anyone familiar with the English schools system will be aware that there are profound differences between the devolved set-up there, giving school heads responsibility for performance and budgets, and the centralised, bureaucratic arrangements here.
Why have successive politicians retained a model that no longer has credibility in the UK but is one that concentrates enormous power in the hands of a few officials here?
The thrust of the questions might be uncomfortable but they demand answers.
Moreover, there is one overriding driver in this: children go to school just the once, so it has to be the best possible.
Thursday 23 February
- Recycling and export is the way forward for waste
- UK mail will arrive later
- Free motoring supplement
- Herm prepares for summer
- Win a night at the White House
Island Life
All about Guernsey
Ambassador of the Year 2011
History & Heritage
Visitor Information
Guernsey's government
Campaigns
Voice For Victims
Voice for Victims is a campaign aimed at promoting the rights of those affected by child sexual abuse.
This is Guernsey
Guernsey Press
Useful Links
I hope the GP will take on board the valid comments of John Lamb.
Sadly this article blatantly indicates that they haven’t done so yet.
Report abuse
Are you sure your not John Lamb.
His letter could well have been written by you. All it said was don’t be nasty to the Education Department.
Lamb’s outburst, like that of Peter Sherbourne a few weeks ago, lays the blame, on anyone and everyone, for the poor examination results in the High Schools. By any absolute standard they are not aceptable and the press is right to ask questions.
It may be that the fabric of the schools has some small affect on performance,, but surely it is the quality of teaching that really counts.
After all, so many of the High School failures suddenly, and quickly, understand the basics of Maths and English when they go to the CFE. That must tell us something especially as CFE was planned to have new buildings over 20 years ago. They manage to get results in poor qualiy buildings!!!
Report abuse
Stephen John
Hello again, thanks for your comments. As you are one of the more sensible posters on this forum I welcome your views even though our opinions often differ.
Firstly no I’m not John Lamb.
Now, there seems to be consensus that the GCSE results are not acceptable – you are right and yes the GP is right to question the situation.
John Lamb’s letter had nothing to do with the education debate per se it could have applied to any news story.
John Lamb was appealing for balanced reporting, much as I did on 30 September when I said ‘In the aftermath of this mess I would like to see some balanced reporting in the media so that kids from LMDC can hold their head up whilst in uniform’.
Since then there has been a slow trickle of measured responses to the situation, and the political events have made people realise we all need to calm down and wait for the review before casting judgements.
Report abuse
Stephen John
John Lamb’s letter was not about education at all it was about reporting. That’s why its not filed under the education section of the letters page.
And no I’m not him!
Report abuse
I hope the media will strive to be unbiased – it has no good purpose not to be.
Report abuse
Parent A
I regarded John Lamb’s letter as referring to Education as it ends with “The recent articles and in particular the accompanying editorial comments about the Guernsey Education service indicate a newspaper shamefully intent on the reverse”.
This quote suggests Lamb’s letter was about educational reporting!!!!
Report abuse
Stephen John
No, it’s definitely filed under “Guernsey Press articles” in the letter’s section of This is Guernsey. Not the “education” section which is where Peter Sherbourne’s letter and other letters about education can be viewed.
Report abuse
Stephen John
Maybe Cronkite’s comments on journalism do not remain sound after all. But that was what John Lamb was saying, contrary to the caption in the newspaper.
Report abuse
I am indifferent as to how John Lamb’s letter should be classified, because the real point here is that its content is a complete distortion of the facts. I trust it is not motivated by self interest.
The GP has been instrumental in exposing the shameful standard of education made available to children in the high schools coupled with a conspiracy of the Minister and senior civil servants to cover that up and mislead the public. And I use the words shameful, conspiracy and mislead deliberately.
It is a fundamental requirement of civil society that public servants and politicians should be accountable for their performance and actions. There is very little evidence of this in this case. It is the duty of a free press to ensure that they are held to account.
I absolutely fail to recognise in the editorial comment of Meesrs Mann or Roffey what Mr Lamb characterises as: “a style of journalism which encourages outrageous hype deliberately designed to incite division, conflict and a blame culture, exacerbated by the use of propaganda on behalf of individuals and the promotion of ‘witch hunts’.”
In my view the GP has been very measured in its response. I have been hugely impressed by the GP’s championing of this issue and would contrast it with the editorial stance proudly advocated to my class at school by its then editor when we are told that “we are not here to make waves”.
I can only assume that Mr Lamb would prefer such a stance and to continue to sweep anything that may be distasteful under the carpet. That is not a recipe for progress or in the best interests of the Island.
Report abuse
Georigia
You seem to favour a tabloid style of news reporting.
The bygone editor who stated “we are not here to make waves” was right and you are correct to contrast this with the current style.
I agree with you about Nick Mann and Peter Roffey – they have their own columns as vehicles in which to share their personal opinions. I find Peter Roffey’s views in particular very balanced and interesting.
I think it was the news articles themselves and editorial comments like this “opinion” article which John Lamb was getting at because there has not been much difference between the two.
Report abuse
If your correspondent “John Lamb” is the John Lamb who has just retired from Deputy Director of Education then shame on him. He is up to his neck in the mess that the Education Department is in and is just as culpable as Neale and his sycophants. Come on “John Lamb”, come clean and tell us who you are.
Report abuse
Grumpy Teacher
Where is the shame in reminding everyone that events should be reported in a neutral and balanced manner?
This thread is about the power of the press and whether tabloid style journalism has a place in local politics.
Report abuse
Parent A asks “whether tabloid style journalism has a place in local politics”.
If it is the only way the general public are made aware of problems that exist in the education system then the answer is yes.
Sadly, the elected deputies,and this includes former teachers in the States, but not on Education committee, failed the public, so good on the Guernsey Press for informimg the public of the dire state of affairs that exists.
Report abuse
Stephen John
I have no problem with the local media highlighting political areas which may be of public concern. It is an essential role they play. But why should tabloid style be the only way? Surely you can see the dangers to democracy in our society if the media on our island did not act in a responsible and neutral manner.
My point is that John Lamb has highlighted an area of public concern too.
Report abuse
ParentA
As we do not have a party political system in Guernsey there is a need for someone to take on the role of opposition or, to give it its full title in a parliamentary democracy, “Her Majesty’s Loyal Opposition.” In this case the Guernsey Press has admirably taken on this role in publicly challenging the Education Department and allowing the matter to be debated.
Guernsey operates an education system which was abandoned in England in 1993. It is very expensive and ineffective at raising standards because too much money is retained centrally supporting a wasteful bureaucracy and schools are not empowered to make their own decisions. It should be challenged and well done to the Press and Jane Stephens for raising the questions. Keep up the good work.
Report abuse
Grumpy teacher
Thank you for this.
If the editors of the paper have unofficially taken office in a role of “her majesty’s loyal opposition” then democracy is well and truly dead as they are accountable to no one.
I think you may be right about the education system but if it was the intention of Jane Stephens or the press to raise awareness of the inefficiencies 18 years seems a long wait and this is a peculiar way of doing things. Besides how would you therefore explain the outstanding performance of the colleges and grammar?
Report abuse
Grumpy teacher
do you by any chance teach history, law or politics or maybe even media studies? RE/ethics then? No?
just wondered.
Report abuse
ParentA,
Yes, the Press are not directly accountable, because they do not wield direct power over our Education system. The accountable body is the democratically elected Education authority.
I don’t think anybody really disagrees that there is some truth in what you are saying. What seems odd is that you are spending hundreds and hundreds of words flinging a lot of mud at the Press, while acknowledging only in passing that education in Guernsey may be systemically broken. There are more egregious examples of ‘tabloid’ journalism in the Press all the time – why do you pick up particularly on this one? This seems to me (and virtually everyone on this forum it seems) to be one case where the end justified the means!
If Roffey’s views are balanced, I’d be interested to know if you think that includes this comment (from http://www.thisisguernsey.com/2011/09/08/what-do-we-want-information/):
‘That was just the latest in a long history of secrecy at that department. Its corporate culture seems to be imbued with the view that controlling behaviour and rationing information will ensure that power remains where it rightly belongs – at the top of the educational hierarchy.
‘And by that I don’t mean the Education minister or the members of the political board.’
Report abuse
ParentA,
I think Jane Stephens has acted the way she has because there is no other avenue open to States Deputies. She used her constitutional right to ask a question in the States which Education was refusing to answer through the normal channels.
You say 18 years is a long wait but don’t forget there was a report into the Education Department in February 2008 which said “carrying on as now cannot be a sound basis for success.” Nothing was done as a result of that report, which is why we are where we are now.
Also, by what measure do you rate the Grammar School and the Colleges as “outstanding”? I believe they are quite average when compared with similar schools. I think they are adversely affected by high staff turnover, which is not the fault of those who work there.
Report abuse
ChrisJ
I take on board what you say about other examples of tabloid journalism but I am posting as a parent who has chosen to get involved in the education debate. I have commented heavily about education matters on other threads.
I picked up on John Lamb’s letter mainly because I felt the stigma encountered by the children and staff, at LMDC in particular, had been exacerbated by the hype of the reporting. Also I feel that some of the personal and professional attacks on individuals from various sources were untoward.
The Press are at liberty to moderate the comments of posters. I am respectful of this as I have chosen to use a Press website to express my views. In such a situation it is never certain which words will be published therefore I accept that I have not been economical with my postings. Also I admit I have tried to stimulate a debate for the sake of my own interest in others views of this matter.
Thank you for having an interest in my view on the Peter Roffey article which I would agree seems close to the edge of tabloid style. He incites intrigue in his reader but I think stops short of being defamatory while making his views crystal clear. In any case this is his personal opinion and not a news article being written as a report of facts.
I agree with transparency in politics and in news reporting, however I can understand the temptation to try to protect vulnerable groups such as children from undue consequences when the public have access to information which may be out of context or which they don’t fully understand. It is impossible to do this though without being questioned over ulterior motives or seeming to patronise the public and clearly that was the fatal flaw in what has happened here.
I do not know what Carol Steere’s true motives were but clearly the board agreed on a course of action and all I can say is that as a parent of an affected child I understand that course of action and appreciate it, albeit it was the wrong one.
Report abuse
Grumpy Teacher
I thought the normal channels were as described on the education website in the news section under “response to rule 5 question on GCSE results” which also indicates that Jane Stephens already had the answers.
Are you saying that’s wrong?
I expect some things have been done but evidently not with the specific objective of the High schools achieving the UK GCSE benchmark.
By comparison to LMDC High! I take your point but the fact that one pupil achieved 15 A* GCSEs is outstanding by any measure. So do you think the education department can be blamed for high staff turnover?
Report abuse
ParentA,
We all totally agree that vulnerable children and hard-working staff should ideally be protected from the consequences of negative publicity. But the flip side of that coin is that we only have the necessary review underway because Jane Stephens asked the difficult questions, and because if the States had done nothing then the Press would inevitably have hit them with the full force of a million tabloid monkeys, as they have done Education. Thanks to Jane Stephens and the Press, things are still salvageable.
We should be concerned of course that Education allowed the situation to arise in the first place, but above all we should be concerned that they did handle the questions better. As it is Carol Steere has achieved very little in the way of mitigating the impact of the release on staff and students, whilst conspicuously expending a great deal of effort attempting to mitigate the impact on herself.
Nobody is accusing anyone involved of doing anything other than what they think is right for education in Guernsey. But the bottom line is that something has gone badly wrong – the results from some schools over the last three years have slid, for whatever reason, well below even the most pessimistic projections of what they ought to be. Somewhere some people are, despite their best efforts, not delivering the results they are paid to deliver.
You might reasonably dismiss as premature speculation the theory that the culture of the Education Department is a major causal factor. But people ‘in the know’ are keen to make a big deal about this particular aspect of the problem because they want everyone (the reviewer, States members and the public) to understand that it is a major factor, and that if this review going to bottom it out, then it’ll have to untangle some of the tricky questions about how Education works operationally: how they formulate policy, how they consult, what gets delegated, what doesn’t.
There is more to give cause for concern. The Jane Stephens tribunal judgement and Robinson report made it clear that the current Director’s style is best described as ‘autocratic’, and the suspicion is that this may be having deleterious effects. And because the Department’s culture repeatedly throws spanners into the working of democratic accountability, it’s worrying to consider the possibility that Derek Neale’s style may spill over from operational matters into matters of policy which should rightly be the preserve of the elected Board.
The main reason Peter Roffey’s article was not defamatory was not because it skirts around the question of where responsibility lies – it’s because it’s true.
Report abuse
Juliet
I don’t have their CVs in front of me but I think it is a well established fact that politics is one of many many careers where formal qualifications are not required. Politicians are qualified by their election by the public. If academic qualifications were mandatory to enter politics I think it would compromise democracy.
Perhaps you have illustrated that too much emphasis is placed on academic qualifications and there is a lot more to education and future success than GCSE results.
Regarding your question about John Lamb – I don’t know who he is but anyone is permitted to express their opinion publicly- again no qualifications required.
Report abuse
ChrisJ
Thanks for your comments which I read with interest.
The education website seems to respond to all the points you raise in your first paragraph far better than I could.
http://www.education.gg/article/4283/Response-to-Rule-5-questions-on-GCSE-results
I tend to agree with you about mitigating the impact but I’m not sure what more could have been done once the rabbit was out of the hat and trying to stay in power to continue with policies is only natural.
There are many mitigating circumstances surrounding the GCSE results as eloquently outlined in Peter Sherbourne’s letter to the press and other people who understand the situation better than me.
Therefore I personally think the review was unnecessary and I would have preferred to see the money spent where I feel it is most needed. However I’m sure the review will add value. The press and public have put great emphasis on the GCSE benchmark and its decline which is understandable so I’m hopeful the review will have specific answers and workable solutions.
I agree with you that the rumours about a flawed culture need to be addressed but it does seem that the press and public want to throw the baby out with the bath water. Nevertheless I’m very curious also as to why ministers appear to have been sitting on their hands, there must be a reason.
Maybe its true – yes it looks likely but I believe in innocent until proven guilty and will stick by that principle!
Report abuse
ParentA
Seriously you are now directing people to the Education website!! Next thing will you be giving out CS’s mobile number and tell people when to call?
Report abuse
Simon
If you would like to believe it was necessary for Jane Stephens to ask the questions then don’t bother reading the facts.
If you would like to base your opinions on the truth you know where to find it.
Any questions feel free to ring Carol Steere or Jane Stephens anytime their numbers are public.
Report abuse
some comments here makes me think that some would have the press controlled about what it says. I think the public as a whole is educated enough to pick the truth out. Governments are known to try and hush embarrassing issues. When I was a kid the Guernsey Press was known as a “States News sheet” becuase of its biased views. Many scandals in recent years have only come about from a free press and I for one would not like to see that go back. If and when the press oversteps the line then it should be punished as in the News of the World scandal. Free press is vital in a democratic society.
Report abuse
Gsyboy
If you think integrity is a form of control (albeit self control) then yes it should be.
Someone can correct me if I’m wrong but there is no equivalent of the press complaints commission in Guernsey and therefore the press may overstep the line whenever it chooses.
I’m not sure whether the News of the World would have broken any law in Guernsey. Also I cannot imagine any politician for example trying to sue for libel.
I agree with freedom of the press but any reporting will ideally be both factual and impartial and in this article the Guernsey Press has told us it strives to be both. Quite rightly.
You hit the nail on the head by saying the public are able to pick out the truth nevertheless we should never get complacent about what we are reading. The saying that “you should not believe what you read in the papers” should not apply here.
I’m not sure whether all the comments in this particular article have succeeded in being factual and impartial but as the headline implies adhering to this policy is always going to be “difficult”.
The Press has the power to destroy careers, tarnish reputations and create divisions in society but if it is mindful of this and adheres to its own integrity policies then surely it can’t go wrong.
Report abuse
ParentA
It WAS necessary for Jane Stephens to invoke Rule 5 to ask the question as Education refused to answer otherwise. The link on the website was only put there when the Education Department realised they had no choice and I think it was posted on the same day the answer was given in the States.
re staff turnover, Dave Jones has implied that Housing would be more sympathetic to licence applications for teachers but Education is not pressing for it. I bleieve that very high turnover in the maths dept at St Sampsons has made a contribution to the poor results there. If someone knows more that I please back me up. In general the 5 year licence scheme is very expensive to maintain, does not keep the population down and is detrimental to our children’s education. Teachers here on 5 year licences will start looking for a job after 3 years. I know this from personal experience as a parent whose child was very disadvantaged in the GCSE year.
re John Lamb, I don’t know how many people called “John Lamb” live in Guernsey but someone of this name has recently retired as Deputy Director of Education.
btw Parent A, I am a mathematician by training but have taught most of the subjects you list!
Report abuse
Grumpy Teacher
Jane Stephens already had the answers to those questions in writing!
She chose to undermine the course of action decided upon by the education board. Answer’s given in the states are public information which is why she decided to ask again in a different way! The answers were posted the same day and no sooner because they were a transcript of what was said that day.
I agree that teacher recruitment and turnover is a problem but I feel this is due to our housing law. Dave Jones has made the problem clear to me on another thread and I’m not sure what can be done as the housing control issue takes priority.
If as you suggest the continuity problem might be improved by recruiting more local teachers and fewer licensees then why do you seem surprised if Education are not pressing for more licenses?
I was a little shocked at your suggestion that the local Press should be encouraged to act as political opposition that was all.
Report abuse
Parent a
You say of Jane Stephens “She chose to undermine the course of action decided upon by the education board”.
Bringing this issue to the notice of the public undermining the education board” Bit of an arrogant comment. Mrs Stephens had every right to bring the information to the attention of the media and public.
Your increasingly desperate PR exercise, and inside knowledge, suggest you are far closer to the inmates of the Grange than you make out.
Report abuse
Well said Stephen John.
ParentA, I think you are Carol Steere. You have changed a few details, e.g you have a child at LMDC, Carol Steere’s son is at Les B. You keep telling people to calm down, Carol says don’t get hysterical.
I don’t think the Press should be in the role of Opposition but no-one else, with the exception of Jane Stephens seems to be willing to take on this role, which is essential in any democracy. Very serious problems were revealed within the Education Department in 2007-2008 and if we had an Opposition in the States Education would rightly have been hauled over the coals for it but nothing was done. In fact those Education Offices and Law Officers responsible for the debacle all moved to higher things. I am shocked that Richard McMahon is about to move to higher offices when he was the advocate who led Education into such a disastrous confrontation wich they were bound to lose at great expense to the public.
Carol, sorry if I have burst your bubble.
Report abuse
Stephen John
I explained where I’m coming from in my post on October 27th at 12.39pm. The only inside knowledge I have is as a parent.
The numbers were in the public domain before she asked the questions albeit the Press didn’t print them in the paper. I seem to recall Peter Roffey said “any deputy fancy asking a question in the states?” which seems to have prompted her to do so.
Report abuse
Grumpy teacher
I’m not Carol Steere.
I can’t imagine why she would pretend to be someone else.
Calm down and don’t get hysterical is generally good advice!
Clearly you don’t approve of our political framework but that is no reason to try to force it to be something its not. There are benefits to the way it is. The public have direct access to the deputies who are obliged to do our bidding.
Jane Stephens has not taken up the role of opposition!
I have no idea whether problems identified in the past were addressed to any extent but I am curious to know how and why Derek Neale has survived the intense criticism. I can only guess that he has support from others who have a better understanding of the situation than I do. He must have done something right during the last ten years.
Regarding the unfair dismissal I’m in no position to make judgements but I think that the dismissal was probably right but wasn’t done properly. In any case I think Jane Stephens is now well placed in the states. Alls well that ends well.
Report abuse
ParentA,
How do you know Jane Stephens already had the answers in writing when she put the questions to the States? Either you have inside knowledge, or you are reading more into Education’s media release than it actually says.
Report abuse
Parent A is curious to know how and why Derek Neale has survived the intense criticism.
A good question. Whitewash, cover up, are words that spring to mind.
Report abuse
ChrisJ – I strive to be factual and impartial but its difficult ;-)
Having said that there were uncannily accurate blog posts and hearsay beforehand.
Stephen John – Whitewash, cover up = self defeating. Maybe you have answered how but what about why?
Report abuse
ParentA,
That comes across as a curiously evasive answer!
Do you have inside knowledge? If not, where exactly did you get the information that Jane Stephens already had all the answers in writing (you’ve given two possible different sources in this thread)? If you didn’t know that for sure, why did you say it, and why did you lambast someone else (Grumpy Teacher) for doubting it?
Report abuse
ChrisJ
I’m being interrogated! I wish more people would interrogate the newspapers in this manner. After all this thread is debating whether or not it is necessary to question what is published. News reports are just one source of information available to the public and there are many other trusted sources of information.
I stand by all my comments. I am not an insider and nor is the press.
Am I a trusted source? You decide.
Report abuse
ParentA
If you actually believe that Jane Stephens’ dismissal was justified you clearly haven’t read the judgement. Go to http://www.gov.gg/ccm/navigation/commerce—employment/employment-tribunal-service/tribunal-decisions-2007/ and you will find the link.
The whole case hinged around whether or not Le Rondin school was ready. Neale said it was, Stephens said it wasn’t, and the evidence was clearly that Jane Stephens was correct. Neale couldn’t take it and the rest is history.
Why Neale has survived the intense criticism, God only knows but the fact that no-one ever sees him might have something to do with it.
Report abuse
Grumpy teacher
I have read this judgement before but thank you for refreshing my memory! Clearly the dismissal was technically unfair as was proved by the legal process but I still feel it was the right thing that she left.
It seems that Mr Neale’s biggest shortcoming was that he didn’t deal with things sooner and didn’t adhere to the rule book with the disciplinary process. Inexcusable but easily done. Lesson learned.
The wide ranging criticisms of Jane Stephens within the report seem to indicate that unfortunately she was unsuitable for the job. It seems she was a very grumpy teacher! I would be concerned if she was in charge of my child’s school.
Regarding the school building – clearly all legal approvals had been obtained and all the relevant authorities had given their consent to the opening.
Report abuse
I stand corrected!
There was a notice in Tuesday’s Press from the Press Complaints Commission inviting readers to complain if editorial content in the Press includes inaccuracy or intrusion which affects them.
It seems that the Press are bound by the PCC Code of Practice which is most reassuring.
Report abuse
Parent A
The fact that you seem to spend a lot of time defending the Education Board and slagging off the GP will lead Joe Public to summise that you have a vested interest in doing so.
Why do You hide your name?
You seem to spend a lot of time researching your subject, do you work at all?
Does anybody apart from SJ, CJ & GT actually care what you post?
Report abuse
Ed
Yes I do have a vested interest – my child and the school. I’ve hidden my identity simply because I’m a parent.
As the GP has decided to join the PCC they obviously welcome feedback and I’m just saying think of the kids.
The majority of my posts have been responses to questions like yours and yes I’m sure most readers are not interested in my boring but well researched opinions!
Report abuse
Parent A
re Jane Stephens’ unfair dismissal, you are trotting out the familiar Education Department party line as written for Martin Ozanne.
Firstly, do you think that the most vulnerable children in the island should have been working in a building where the builders remained on site after the school opened, which was so cold (because of major problems with the heating and ventilatin systems) that the staff had to work in overcoats and where buckets had to be left around to catch the rainwater? All because the department were desperate to get the building opened “on time and on budget”
And secondly, if the tribunal had agreed with your view that Jane Stephens had somehow contributed to her own downfall they would have reduced the amount of their award. In the event they “were not persuaded by any relevant testimony” and gave her the full amount allowed.
Report abuse
Grumpy teacher – are you Jane Stephens?
Report abuse
Parent A
can you not devote more time to the LMDC parent teacher association?
It might have more of a positive impact on your childs schooling that batting the same PR line on here twenty times a day.
Just a thought…
Whatever happened to the PR lady at education?
Report abuse
Ed
LMDC High does not have a PTA
Sorry for any inconvenience caused by your apparent interest in what I have to say.
Report abuse
Parent A
Perhaps you should ride to the rescue, you seem to have the drive, passion, time and knowledge to do a great job for them.
Report abuse
Parent A
I am not Jane Stephens. I have met her when she was still a teacher and I can’t say I found her a particularly warm and cuddly person, however I recognised a highly intelligent and gifted professional, extremely knowledgeable about all aspects of special needs and her demise was a tragic loss to the education service, which cannot be measured in terms of ££.
I think we are going round in circles here. I am pinning my hopes on Mr Denis Mulkerrin and his review. Having ‘googled’ him I note he has had a very successful career in turning round a failing comprehensive school. I hope he can reflect on the situation here and can make the correct recommendations. I can only say a huge THANK YOU to the Guernsey Press for bringing this into the public domain and allowing this to be debated.
and no – I am not Richard Digard either.
Report abuse
Just heard a bloke from Education talking about a survey on what parents / carers think of kids quality of life.
Sorry?
Apart from the fact this survey’s findings revealed the bleeding obvious, what on earth is the point of this – get on with the proper job of educating our children. Its pathetic.
Report abuse
Grumpy teacher
I’m sure Jane Stephens does have great strengths and I hope she is intent on using her talents for public benefit rather than abusing her position to cause mischief for personal revenge.
For her to be successful in a role of education minister as you would like, there would have to be an unfair dismissal of Derek Neale. There is clearly a personality clash between the two and the two working together would surely be disastrous.
You mentioned earlier about the Robinson review stating that “carrying on as now cannot be a sound basis for success”
This quote referred to the issue of unfair criticism being heaped on Derek Neale from all angles. Being a civil servant and not a politician he has been in no position to defend himself.
What seems to have been done about this is that the review noted that everyone, even his critics, agreed that he had been highly successful over ten years and that this justified his strong leadership style and personality, therefore the education board clearly backed him up to continue his good work.
Mr Mulkerrin will be able to verify whether or not anything is now broken here and whether or not claims of school failure and all the criticisms are valid.
Until that time I am hoping that the media can desist from casting their own judgements via sensational headlines and opinions to the detriment of the reputations of all involved, from the pupils upwards and including the reputation of Guernsey itself.
Report abuse
instead of slagging each other off maybe a good question to ask is
“why doesn’t LMDC have a PTA” to me it speaks volumes.
Report abuse
Why would any dismissal of Derek Neale be “unfair”? There is surely enough evidence in the Jane Stephens tribunal report alone to dismiss him for gross misconduct!
btw, Parent A, you are not Derek Neale by any chance?
Report abuse
Grumpy Teacher
Putting him in the position of having to report to Jane Stephens would be constructive dismissal surely. I don’t think he did things properly but I assume his lawyer agreed there was no gross misconduct. In any case it would be too late now for that, things have moved on.
No I’m not Derek Neale.
Report abuse
Kevin – good idea
Go for it ParentA – if you care so much actions talk louder than words, get a PTA set up?
Report abuse
Its not up to me! I gather the schools have committees instead.
Report abuse
Grumpy Teacher
I think you may have called that one right. Looking back over Parent A’s many postings its easy to imagine them having been written by him!
The phrases “highly successful” and “good work” would be most unlikely to be used today based on a combination of what we now know and actual results.
Whatever it costs to dismiss him would be a bargain before he does any more damage.
Report abuse
Jack
smug post.
I’m asking you why do you think there is no PTA at LMDC?
Report abuse
Should Derek Neale have to report to Jane Stephens as a member of the board (or Minister) it would not constitute “constructive dismissal”. It does constitute an untenable situation for Mr Neale and might precipitate his resignation. Or, they may put their mutual dislike of each other to one side and do what many people in business do; Work together in the best interests of the business, in this case, the children. If either did not put their differences to one side it would represent failure. And there is a price for failure!
Report abuse
SF
I can’t imagine he would go quietly.
Report abuse
Kevin – it wasnt meant to be smug, unfortunately the written word is not as effective as oral communication. Simply saying it would be a good idea to set one up.
As for why there isnt one? No idea, have there ever been PTAs for the high schools? Apathy from parents? Presumably they are allowed PTAs and no one is going to stop them if they set one up are they?
Report abuse
Jack
I gather lack of PTAs is a situation inherited by the current education board. It was flagged up in the Robinson review as a non urgent matter to be reconsidered. I would like to see this happen but its not for parents to decide. I have no knowledge or experience of PTAs or how they compare with the role of the current committees.
Any information from other posters?
Report abuse
Parent A
You say of Neale “Being a civil servant and not a politician he has been in no position to defend himself”.
However, he(you?)managed to write to the Press assuring all was well just days before Mrs Steere confirmed the real facts. You know full well that Neale is perfectly capable of using the media when it suits him.
Can you tell me why, if Jane Stephens was elected a Minister it would automatically mean the unfair dismissal of Neale? What are the precedents in Guernsey and UK law?
Report abuse
Stephen John
I read something along those lines in the Robinson review but point taken in relation to his press letter.
Surely there is no way he could have given any indication in that letter that the results of 2 schools were below the other. That would have been contrary to the board’s democratic decision.
I suspect SF may be better informed than me and seems to have answered your legal question. Maybe they would work well together who knows but I for one would be concerned.
Report abuse